Dr. Michelle Veneziano | Fascial Flow and Connection Is Medicine To Heal

The Hormone Prescription with Dr. Kyrin Dunston

Welcome to the latest episode of The Hormone Prescription Podcast featuring our brilliant guest, Dr. Michelle Veneziano. Dr. Veneziano is an esteemed expert in the field of osteopathic self care and has a deep understanding of the benefits of fascial flow for midlife women. Her unique approach to Cranial Osteopathy not only empowers women with self-healing techniques but also emphasizes the body's innate ability to restore itself.
In this episode, we delve into the fascinating world of fascial flow and connection as medicine to heal. Dr. Veneziano shares her wealth of knowledge on the importance of maintaining natural balance and vitality by aligning ourselves with the world around us. Don't miss out on this engaging conversation as we uncover key takeaways for midlife women who can greatly benefit from this holistic approach to health and wellness.
You'll learn about:
- Dr. Veneziano's specialized approach to Cranial Osteopathy and the healing benefits of fascial flow.
- The role of fascial flow and connection in maintaining a balanced, healthy life for midlife women.
- Practical advice on incorporating osteopathic self-care techniques into your daily routine.
- Personal stories and real-life examples of how fascial flow and connection can improve overall health and well-being.
To continue your journey towards optimal health, make sure to hit that subscribe button for The Hormone Prescription Podcast. We have many more insightful episodes coming your way, featuring the latest topics in women's health, wellness, and self-care. Don't miss out on the knowledge, wisdom, and empowerment you deserve!

Speaker 1 (00:00):

Feel your body every cell in every moment, and relate to the earth as if she is your dance partner. Dr. Michelle Veneziano. Stay tuned to find out why your fascia may be the key to your healing and your superpower, and why you're not walking correctly.

Speaker 2 (00:19):

So the big question is, how do women over 40 like us, keep weight off, have great energy, balance our hormones and our moods, feel sexy and confident, and master midlife? If you're like most of us, you are not getting the answers you need and remain confused and pretty hopeless to ever feel like yourself Again. As an OB GYN, I had to discover for myself the truth about what creates a rock solid metabolism, lasting weight loss, and supercharged energy after 40, in order to lose a hundred pounds and fix my fatigue, now I'm on a mission. This podcast is designed to share the natural tools you need for impactful results and to give you clarity on the answers to your midlife metabolism challenges. Join me for tangible, natural strategies to crush the hormone imbalances you are facing and help you get unstuck from the sidelines of life. My name is Dr. Kyrin Dunston. Welcome to the Hormone Prescription Podcast.

Speaker 1 (01:13):

Hi everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Hormone Prescription. Thank you so much for joining me today as we talk to Dr. Michelle Veneziano, who's an osteopathic physician and very brilliant and progressive in the approaches that she's helping people work on and master when it comes to health and healing. She is trained and helps people with cranial osteopathy, working with their fascia, changing their body movement and posture and nervous system so that they can ignite their body's innate ability to heal. Yes, your body has an innate ability to heal. Just like if you get cut, all you have to do is cover it so it doesn't get wounded again, and then nature takes care of the rest. Well, your whole body actually functions that way, but most of us aren't aware of the bandaid that we need to be placing on the rest of our body, particularly our fascia, our nervous system, to allow healing to occur.

Speaker 1 (02:17):

And sure, you've gotta work on your hormones, you've gotta work on your gut health and your detox and all the things like I like to say. But a big missing piece that even a functional medicine perspective misses, is looking at your fascia. We're gonna talk about why that's super important and how you're walking, how you're connecting above and below how you're connecting to Mother Earth and so many other things that Dr. Michelle really is brilliant when it comes to helping people understand and implement in their lives. So I'll tell you a little bit about her and then we will get started. Dr. Michelle Veneziano is an osteopathic physician and clinical professor who has pioneered osteopathic self-care rooted in cranial osteopathy, a hands-on evidence-based therapeutic practice. That's one of the things I love about her, is she can explain the science behind all of these things that sources both western and eastern philosophies to support the body's ability to heal itself. She has a unique approach and you're gonna love her as much as I love speaking with her. We probably need to do more episodes. She has a lot of resources for you, which we're gonna share at the end of our discussion. And we're gonna talk about walking and relating on the earth as if she's your dance partner. Welcome, Dr. Michelle Veneziano to the show. Thank

Speaker 3 (03:44):

You for having me. I'm glad to be

Speaker 4 (03:45):

Here. I'm so excited to talk about craniosacral therapy and osteopathic medicine and fascia and un fascial unwinding. This is my new obsession, like I was just telling you. And so I know a lot of people are going, what we're talking about craniosacral what and fascial what , but maybe let's start with the basics because I think a lot of people see doctor of osteopathic medicine, they see medical doctor and they don't really know the difference. So can you talk a little bit about , the basics? Like what is osteopathy? How does a doctor of osteopathy differ from a medical doctor? What's different about it? And then we'll, mm-Hmm. go from there.

Speaker 3 (04:30):

Osteopath that trained in the US are medical doctors. It's very confusing for patients. I totally sympathize with that. And most of the osteopaths dos people with a DO degree are pretty indistinguishable from MDs. And there's this tiny sliver of our profession that has really devoted, we've devoted ourselves to maintaining the traditional osteopathic principles and practice, which go back to the 18 hundreds actually. Mm-Hmm. . So people might say, oh, my surgeon's a do and I might think that probably means they do surgery and they don't necessarily use their hands or work with the traditional principles. And the thing that's relevant about that is that even though a do may have chosen surgery, there is a foundational principle of more connectedness to sensation, more connectedness to touch. Generally DOS are maybe a little bit more relatable. They're used to being a little bit more intimate in their conversations. So even if your do is an emergency room doctor or you know a gastroenterologist, there's something about DOS that's a little bit more human. And I actually don't want to, there's a lot of MDs also that even practice osteopathy, so it's pretty hard to explain. And I would say the percentage of doss that actually use their hands is very small. So it's hard to find us and we're all different, so it's hard to define what we do.

Speaker 4 (06:04):

Let's talk about what you do. So you pioneer a type of self-care that's rooted in cranial osteopathy. Can you talk a little bit about that? You say that it's evidence-based therapeutic practice that sources both western and eastern philosophies to support the body's ability to heal itself. So in plain English, if you were talking to, if I introduced you to my friend Sarah, what would, how would you explain what that means?

Speaker 3 (06:33):

Most of what people see osteopathic doctors for is to have our hands on them and solve all of the structural issues and the way that electricity flows through the body. And basically, ultimately it's a reboot, blending all of those things. So they actually arrive in time and space and their subtle body and their physical body come back together when a person is offline or not themselves, not present, not actually in their body. It's like watching a three D movie and having one image. The images aren't together. And so each of us solves that in unique ways. What I'm doing now with the revelation that I had through my own personal experience was that until I figured out what it felt like to almost like a setting on a dial to be in that integrated space, I would get healed. And then I go back out. So I thought, what's wrong with this picture? So many patients are coming, I integrate them and then they gradually dissociate and then at one point they'll come back to be rebooted again. And I, I'm really passionate now about teaching people how to stay in . So I say it's, I'm teaching people how to need fewer treatments, how to hold the treatments that they get and how to not need me. And it just feels so much more of a beautiful service and less of a rescuing codependent approach. Mm-Hmm. to being a care provider.

Speaker 4 (08:04):

So a few things you said in there that I think some people aren't gonna understand. One, you mentioned subtle body. I know some people are scratching their heads going, what is Dr. Michelle talking about? You talked about disassociate. I think some people aren't gonna understand that. Can you, you explain what you meaning?

Speaker 3 (08:23):

Yeah. It's time everyone out there in the world to understand what the energy body is. Yes, everything's energy. If you don't get this, you're really gonna be struggling and not having as much fun. So I'm just gonna say it's time to understand energy. There are universities in this country that study what the biofield is, the OR field, the meridians and the chakras. There are maps of these things there, gazillions of studies explaining that we're actually electrical beings. We're electrical first and physical second. And the brilliance of osteopathy is that the brilliance of nature is that form follows function. So if you have a way to work with your own energy body and keep all of those circuits going, that feeds the physical and is, that's how the body heals. So energy comes first, the structure comes second. So when we have this, osteopaths have this, how do they do it?

Speaker 3 (09:22):

Something magical happened, I don't get it. And it's so efficient and it goes so deep really quickly because we access that principle. We'll go in and it took me years and years to feel anything. I didn't feel anything. I was that person listening who was like, biofield, what is that ? I really was, I'm the perfect, I'm the perfect case because of my own trauma and my own density in a body that was pretty shut down from just arriving. In a world that doesn't get these things, it's quite traumatizing for every single person on the planet to not be acknowledged and be able to have a relationship with that subtle aspect of ourselves. And I'm talking about something very basic. Everyone, this is not esoteric or advanced, right? Primitive people would tune into the subtle wave nature of pres of the physical world, didn't know what the weather was doing and where the predators were, and really feel into the land. How do we grow our food here? What are the seasons doing? This is such basic stuff. And the fact that it hasn't really penetrated mainstream ways of living is really concerning to me. You look at the world, things are not going well. I would say this is the reason you tune into your body and you actually know, oh

Speaker 4 (10:49):

Yeah, because we think we are flesh and bones and so we don't realize who we really are. And so once you get that, you have this subtle electrical body and that really our physicality follows this subtle body. Everybody needs to be addressing it. People are still going to their HMO doctors and they're not getting that information there. So I think that's why they're not aware. But then you talked about with feeling that they have, they have to dis they dissociate and that you need to bring them back. But helping them to learn how to do this themselves. And so how is this self-care, cranial osteopathy, something that can help people to manage their own subtle body?

Speaker 3 (11:32):

I'm gonna really simplify this because I'm an osteopath, okay? But I could be an Ayurvedic doctor, I could be a Chinese medicine doctor. We have different languages for describing the same thing. Okay? How do we connect with the energetic layer of existence? And if we don't do that, the organism of our bodies is going to be in fight or flight on some to some degree. So that's a tie-in to the hormone piece that I, I wanna speak to. And we're also going to feel spiritually, emotionally disconnected. What is this life experience happening? What being in a body is so strange if we don't connect to that deeper. It's almost like when we begin to have an experience as an electrical being and more identifying with that larger aspect of ourselves, we feel things start to make sense and we start to feel like connected to meaning and purpose and that bigger picture that, and most people, they don't have that. And the list of problems that will arise because of that dissociation, that disconnection from our deeper selves is limitless. So people say, how do you solve this? How do you solve that? Get in your body. Feel who you are. So I'm an embodiment teacher. Now I was not in my body, right? I had a whole host of, I could tell you my story for, I've had everything in the book. Please just tell us. I think it would be very instructive. Okay.

Speaker 3 (13:06):

Some of us are born maybe more aware and more sensitive as our base nature. And that was me. I arrived in Brooklyn, New York in the sixties and it was very weird. I remember feeling like I lived in an energetic world. I actually remember as a toddler walking down the street and seeing in colors and sort of feelings thing, feeling I got a lot of information that was bigger and different than what people were saying and doing. So it looked like I was in a movie. And then slowly I forgot all that. 'cause I grew up and I remember, and this is what happens to us, children are very spiritually connected typically, unless there's some horrific birth trauma experience. And then we slowly, so gradually acculturate to this different energetic collective kind of uncon, I'm gonna call it the collective unconscious of the planet.

Speaker 3 (14:04):

And it's heartbreaking and it's so gradual and unconscious. People don't really get that it even happened. They just wake up one day often as adolescents. And life is just not right. So many people are on antidepressants. The suicide rates are so high and there's this sort of vague, what is it? And then the surge goes on and on and then the list of physical things goes on and on. And I loved the episode with that. You did with Dr. Amit Agarwal. I was listening earlier and I just loved how he went into all these layers and speaking to how we have to begin to or get to, you said we have to. This is a beautiful invitation to come back to ease and grace and it's so much life. Makes sense. And it's so much simpler when we drop into that deeper layer of wisdom and connection to the planet.

Speaker 3 (15:04):

It's a literal electrical connection to the earth. It's a polarity. We actually become connected to the positive iion forces of the ionosphere and then the grounding. It's the yin pole of the earth. And so we begin to connect heaven and earth through our bodies and log on this infinite well of power and wisdom and intelligence in the universe. I just described what a spiritual experience typically is for most people. They somehow connect. It could be psychedelics, it could be a revelation that comes or a healing that comes or, and but, and what is that thing? And how do we actually live there? And somehow we're gonna connect this to fascia because you're really interested in fascia. And fascia is relevant to what I'm saying. So back to my story, I was not in my body at all. And then I arrived in, I think I was 15 years old and I had this accidental intellectual exposure to psychedelic medicine.

Speaker 3 (16:10):

It was a peyote medicine. And I've never said this in public before, but I think it's really relevant now that I saw it all. It's like, am I observer, self stepped back and looked at the whole movie and I was remember feeling, don't, how did I end up here? This is the wrong place. It's, it was very dark because the world's very dark. It's very, it's impossible to understand or feel resolution toward without this bigger site being in the body gives you bigger sight, simplifies things and resources. The physical self with the energy needed and the intelligence needed to heal. So I think that's where my journey began in the sense of, oh, I'm actually going to move toward understand I'm gonna solve this. And the same, it was the same year I got the download. I remember walking across the courtyard of my high school and it was almost like a boy said, you're going to medical school.

Speaker 3 (17:13):

And at the time I didn't even, I didn't know what that meant. I just thought books are easier than people. Let's do it. . So I had to heal myself. And then the whole process of my 20 years in practice was getting into my body. At first it's a little terrifying 'cause it's uncharted territory and there's all this backlog. So consciously or otherwise, when you say embodiment, it's a little bit terrifying to the subconscious. What is that? It's a total unknown. I might be an expert in a million things and I go in this direction and I feel totally disoriented and out of my depth. Hey, I understand. I'm with you on that. And so I had was a distance runner to deal with all my stress and medical school and existential stress is what I would say is the biggest thing. This kind of, I'm not gonna look at the world.

Speaker 3 (18:10):

I'm just gonna study a lot and run like 10 miles a day to just move all the energy of that terror. I would say that most of us carry somewhere in ourselves, whether or not we're connected to it moment to moment. And I had physical issues, big time, adrenal stuff. I had blown a disc in my low back 'cause I was so not present with my structure. I just was running all those endorphins. And then I got to fix it all. And it took many years. And I realized at one point, wow, I'm getting all these amazing treatments. But until I got in my body and was driving that blend of the physical and electrical, it didn't stick. Mm-Hmm . So I thought my biggest service to the world would be to help people have a lot of fun doing this, driving of their integrated self.

Speaker 3 (19:06):

So I actually wanna talk about really specific things today. Two epic super simple things that people can begin to do right now, like in this moment is connect your tongue to the roof of your mouth. Because the pituitary, which guides all the entire endocrine system hormones, cortisol that topic is so deep and I really love how Dr. Agarwal addressed it. So I'm not gonna talk about it. I'll invite everyone to go listen to that podcast. Is that when our tongue is dissociated from the roof of our mouth, it's actually pretty difficult to blend the three D movie into one physical and subtle body. It's almost like a set point for the main river of life force through the center of the body, which is called the central channel in Chinese medicine. And sh shara in sh sh. Thank you. Thank you. . Oh, in Ayurvedic medicine, this is this.

Speaker 3 (20:06):

And in osteopathy we call it the midline. Everything. Everything relates to the midline. So the physical and the subtle, we've got to, we get to begin to tune into what that channel is that connects us to the earth. And the ionosphere. It's a literal electrical circuit. I have papers in physics that describe how we participate in this circulation. It's not a vague, esoteric or really hypothetical. This is all mapped out in physics and mathematics. I have to close my window here just a second. So the tongue on the roof of the mouth, I say having a well-functioning tongue is like having an osteopath living in your head. And in Ayurvedic teachings, in the Vedic teachings, they describe a chakra in the roof of the mouth called the Soma chakra. That when the tongue is trained to land on the roof of my of your mouth and I speak all about how you get this to happen on my website in a blog called Your Swallows Mile and sleep are more related than you think.

Speaker 3 (21:17):

And so I have people start to really experience how wonderful it feels to have this connection come back in. And I can see you're doing it right now, , you're playing with that the entire polyvagal pathway, the vagus nerve is, is almost like massaged with every swallow. When the tongue lands on the roof of your mouth and mechanically it's one to six pounds of pressure every time you swallow one to 2000 times a day. And that pulses and keeps the pituitary awake and it keeps the connection between the heart and the pineal active. So this is an very direct nervous system. Calming and electrical system activation. There's a super cool idea. It's gonna affect fascia too because you're gonna begin to activate the electrical flow through the body, which then basically supercharges the fascia. And what we wanna do is get our energy moving. That's all I'm talking about.

Speaker 3 (22:18):

At the end of the day, you could call this podcast, get your energy moving and also get it in focus. Not all, most people are walking around, they're like a symphony of musical instruments that are all doing different things. It's crazy. And then we wanna get the symphony in tune. So tongue on the palette. And I wanted to say something. Oh, it's such a deep topic. I really encourage people to go read that blog. It's, I have a whole free self-study library. And then specifically, I'm 59 years old. I look like maybe I'm 45. I never have pain, I don't get sick ever. And I believe it's because of this constant flushing that I've, ult that I've gradually cultivated. My base setting is that I live in this place where there's powerful energy radiating out from my midline at all times. But this is very much like what martial artists do.

Speaker 3 (23:20):

This is what yogis do. This is the actual purpose of those practices. And then the toning and correction of things like joint pain and fill in the blank, everything extend from those things. Yoga, qigong, tai chi, frankly just being in a body is all those things all the time. They're not practices for me that I set aside time to do. I'm doing them in every moment. And I don't even know it because that's just who we're born being. So my entire teaching is about let's just reboot and restore to all the things we did naturally when we were born. Everything that works, everything that's good, you are already an expert in, it's just dormant intelligence. So tongue on the palate is where we're gonna start. And that's one connection, one gate, every joint in the body, the palate has multiple joints. Actually our gates in Chinese medicine that they talk about in Qigong, they talk about how every joint in the body is a gate through which this electric electricity must flow.

Speaker 3 (24:32):

So cranial, we started out, what does cranial mean? The entire skull behaves in a certain way when there's a lot of vital energy flowing through it. It actually pulses. We call this a rhythm cranial rhythm that is, do you have one or don't you? If you don't, things aren't gonna go well. And so someone might walk in and say, oh I have adrenal fatigue, I have migraines. Okay, cranial rhythm or not cranial rhythm. It doesn't really matter what the symptom is. It matters if you're breathing the entire body, including the fascia, bones and muscle must be integrated and pulsing in this beautiful fluid way that renders our system like an engine in tune. It becomes very fluid and efficient. That's a physical description of flow. State flow state's actually physical and it's also subtle electrical. So the second thing, that was my major revelation that made me so happy and is the reason I don't have pain.

Speaker 3 (25:34):

And it's the reason I'm super fit. Despite really not doing anything but using every cell in my body when I walk. And every moment when I sit the whole time I'm talking to you, I'm feeling not consciously, there's no work to this. Once you land in it again, this is you. I'm feeling and connected to every cell in my body. Every cell in my body is participating in everything I'm doing. Breathing, walking, moving, feeling. So it's like a constant state of refreshing, clearing, rejuvenating every cell in the body in every moment. So I hope that wasn't too complex. I do wanna talk about the specifics of how we walk to start to activate that power. Do you wanna say anything? Please,

Speaker 4 (26:25):

Please do. So let's see. I definitely wanna talk about fascia. So , if you wanna go there and then we can, if you wanna start talking about fascia, that would be

Speaker 3 (26:35):

Great. It's beautiful that you have this idea to talk about fascia because when the skull is doing this pulsing, the pelvis is also doing the pulsing. The entire body is a spring. Every joint is expanding contracting in relation to the earth. When that's happening, the fascia does not have to protect us. There's a quality when someone walks in and I'm like, do you have a cranial rhythm or don't you? Well if you don't, you're probably also gonna be physically shrink wrapped in fascia that's trying to protect you and isn't really hydrated or awake or supple and adaptable. So the tongue practice that I just described will actually begin to allow your fascia to back off the need to protect the body. Because once that electrical midline comes in, it's like the trunk of a tree and the entire, all the limbs can relax because they're connected to this power powerful central river. This is a key point. If you don't have a midline, your fascia is going to be doing all kinds of things. And how do you know? Because you'll stretch and then the next day you have to stretch again. You didn't actually, it doesn't stay supple in awake. Does that

Speaker 4 (27:51):

Make sense? I wanna, yes it does. Michelle, but I wanna just back up one second because I think most people have the idea of what fascia is the same as what I was basically taught in medical school and residency, which it's this kind of canvas like coating that encases all your bones, nerves, organs and keeps them from moving and holds them in place. But I have gotten such a deeper understanding and respect actually for what fascia is. It not only encases everything, but it attaches to every single cell in your body, every single cell. And it attaches to the structure or kind of the cytoskeleton of each cell. So this is the superhighway by which every cell in your body is connected. And please correct me if I'm wrong and elaborate, but it's faster than the nervous system. And it's why a flock of birds can move seamlessly all in one direction without communicating.

Speaker 4 (28:53):

And it's actually what causes the fastest coordination of movement in our body. And it has awareness and consciousness and stores memories and thoughts and all this. And so this is my new fascination with fascia. So I'd love it if you can elaborate on that so that everyone has a a context for what you're saying. I don't want them to discount it and say, oh that's just that white canvassy stuff. Like when we used to do surgery, it was the tissue we had to get through to get to the uterus, but we really didn't pay it much attention. But it's so much more than that.

Speaker 3 (29:24):

Oh, I'm so excited that you're so excited to talk about fascia. 'cause It is misunderstood.

Speaker 4 (29:30):

It's,

Speaker 3 (29:31):

And it does connect to every cell. And in terms of this reason that a flock of birds, you're, that's one beautiful analogy I use to mm-Hmm just have people get what flow state is, it's everything I'm talking about. And the one piece is there isn't a single aspect of the body that's not a part of shifting to the state of being able to intercommunicate the way of flocker berg's inter communicates. Think about the symphony analogy. There's bone, there are different densities in the body. We have bone, we have muscle, we have dura, we have organ tissue. The fascia connects it all. It's like the information superhighway. But, and every single instrument in the symphony participates the fascia's probably the great harmonizer in order for every cell to and every tissue type to begin to synchronize. So that we do become a flock of birds.

Speaker 3 (30:26):

We literally feel connected to everything and everyone, we are tribal beings. This is a foundational principle related to our ability to really exist in prosperity, expansion, abundance, all of that. So the fascia reflects when the body is in integration. It all comes back to integration. The fascia begins to be this sort of fluid supportive, super efficient conductor of information between every single cell in the body. And this electrical activation of the midline is how the charge comes in. The literal energy of our spirit comes through this channel, through the crown of the head when we're born. And that's not when we're born but in development. And the fascia is like where that electricity is actually stored. It's like a battery. It's like a many layers of the body store charge. But, and the fascia is I'm almost seeing like a science fiction movie where the people are in like a, I'm curious about why this image came in.

Speaker 3 (31:37):

It's like an electrical matrix that just holds it all together and holds potency and intelligence coming through these channels of connection through the sky and the ground. You know how they're doing solar collection of energy through painting like a roof. The fascia is like this absorber of even energy from the sunlight. It's actually like a huge aspect of how the body functions as a bio battery. So there's the subtle body, the electrical that comes in, but the physical actually has to be able to participate in that. And it's an exchange we have to be able to store that power and then allow it to manifest as regrowing a bone. If you break a bone. I think I'm, I might be getting a little bit abstract with this description maybe a little bit. Yeah, . So let's talk about something really specific here. My fascia, I doesn't get tight, right?

Speaker 3 (32:39):

And it's very supple. It's high. The fascia holds a lot of the water in our body, right? It actually is a, is a very powerful place where mo molecules and electricity join to create this really intense expression of power. Like you said, it's not just the neural pathways, it's not just the meridians. The fascia is probably the most powerful physical aspect of electricity expressing in the body or being held in the body. So let's bring it down to something really basic. How is it that I don't really care ever if I get a massage or not? I don't have tension. I'm not shrink wrapped. And one of the ways that I have solved this is that I walk in a way that native people walk tango dancing is a really great way to begin to learn how to activate the back body, which we, we don't do.

Speaker 3 (33:40):

Where fight or flight is an activation of the front body. People have these short hip flexors. So as muscles, all the anterior muscles, all the flexors, they directly tighten the diaphragm and shrink wrap the kidneys and activate the adrenal system. Kidney, renal, adrenal, adrenaline activation of fight, fight or flight. And this returning to native walking just makes the entire conversation so simple. I can't express enough how simply the way you walk, which is how you originally did walk before you unlearned the rigidity of modern ways, right? It's not very American to move in this organic fluid primal way. You will see it more in South America, sometimes in Europe. But, and the stiffness, that is something we learn from simply unconsciously mirroring what we do in our culture shuts down the whole darn thing. Including the ability of the fascia to receive and store and express electricity and power and do its job of hydrating and supporting all the structures of the body.

Speaker 3 (35:00):

So natural walking, what do we do? It's opposite. It's . It's opposite of what we do. We don't activate, we don't let the SOAs do anything. We push off the back from the ball of the foot when we're pushing off from the ground. That is a momentum that then lets the leg glide effortlessly forward. And it's one way I think of it is thinking of the earth as your dance partner. For anyone out there who's a dancer, you don't unconsciously just maybe connect with your partner or not. You keep this very connected, equal tension no matter what you're doing, right? If they move back, you move forward. If they move forward, you move back. This is a version of the flock of birds, right? We're in sync, we're fluid. It's not something you have to think about. You simply stay connected. So you're connecting to the earth. And in doing so, you're activating this midline function that I talked about that lets the whole body melt and lets the joints release and lets the fascia soft and not do its protective shrink wrap thing.

Speaker 4 (36:15):

That's fascinating. And when I was in Argentina recently, I worked with a, a rolfing therapist there who was reteaching me how to walk in the way a manner in which you are stating. And it felt a little bit foreign. But I wanna explain to everyone why I'm so fascinated, fascinated with fascia. Lately I had some experiences with different plant medicines where all I could describe what was happening is this unwinding where my body would make these spontaneous, internally driven movements. They weren't conscious, they were unconscious and was talking with different people about this. What is happening? What's the action? And then I started having them spontaneously because I'm always looking for what are the ways that are stopping us from healing the women I work with myself, the people I know what else is available to us. And so I started experiencing that spontaneously. And then I was at a retreat last weekend here in Dubai and they had something called inner dance. Are you familiar with that?

Speaker 3 (37:20):

I've not heard that term, but I imagine it's related to some of the similar things that there are practices.

Speaker 4 (37:26):

So it's, they use different music tracks to induce brainwave states and then you lay on a mat blindfolded and basically you allow your body to unwind the way it wants to unwind. And that was fascinating 'cause that's fa, excuse me, unwinding. And then I came across this, I think his name's Thomas Atley, he's head of an osteopathic school in England and he had this wonderful lecture on YouTube about the founder of osteopathy and really the significance of fascia. I highly recommend it to anyone who wants to watch. So I really become aware of it as like you're talking about we're so adrenalized. We had a wonderful doctor on a few weeks ago on the podcast who wrote a book I think called Adrenalize. And we are in fight and flight and how the whole front body is contracted as if, what do you do when you are afraid is you contract into fetal position. So all those muscles are pulled down. And so part of healing for everyone I think is freeing this fascia from its chronically tense state. And like you said, you never care if you get a massage. And I'm thinking, oh, I would love to say that one day . So I've been working intensely with my fascia and encouraging all the women I work with to do the same in various ways. I'd love it if we could talk about that. I wash sha is one modality I'm familiar with cupping, fascial flossing. And of course I

Speaker 3 (38:58):

Have something great for you. I have something great for you. Yeah. There's a concept in us in mechanics when musculoskeletal medicine of any kind where there's a principle called reflexive inhibition. So this is so great. If you make a bicep, they tighten your bicep, the tricep will automatically release. So people say, I wanna release my bicep, I'm gonna do cupping and I'm gonna do guhan. And I love those things, don't get me wrong. And I use them but not really that much 'cause I don't really need them. And I say this to people about, I have to quiet my mind. No, you don't just feel you can't do both at the same time. Feeling is like activating your bicep, the mind quiets, you don't need to release your front body, simply activate your back body. And the reciprocal inhibition will release the front body. So it's great you can do fascial treatments, but, and like I said before, if you don't get this deeper relationship that will continually release and blend everything, you're just gonna have to keep doing treatments.

Speaker 3 (40:00):

It's not the root of what would actually bring flow state into all your body systems and then allow the fascia to be this like in martial arts, this very supportive and intensely strong and powerful sleeve of support that's also supple and can melt and allow you to move gracefully and efficiently in the ways that we see are possible. Mm-Hmm. In those practices, Qigong, any of the martial arts are seemingly magical because what they're doing is accessing the so much power and so much precision. And we think, wow, that's amazing. Is that really possible? They do seemingly humanly impossible things and we can do. And

Speaker 4 (40:43):

So when you say activate the back body, are you saying that changing the way we walk is all we need to do? Yes. To activate the back body

Speaker 3 (40:50):

And the way you sit there isn't if, if I get up I will shortly and I will walk to my bathroom and I will, I brush my teeth. I am feeling this kind of grudge, this whole conversation that's happening. Oh, I've been sitting for a while, I don't can't, I don't really feel my glutes activating. When you are walking, you wanna feel those back body muscles working and if you've been sitting for a while and you get up, you probably will notice, oh, I don't really feel them. And so I tell people, crouch like an animal on the ground. Exaggerate the recruiting of all these muscles too. You can feel those back body muscles activate and then gradually and then notice them. You won't have to notice them forever once they're on Mm-Hmm . But in the beginning you need to notice like I'm actually dancing with the earth with the spring, like connected and recruiting of every muscle in every step.

Speaker 3 (41:54):

And this is actually a way to heal your spine. I used to have all kinds of back issues and I remember one time when I built my school, I was sitting at the computer so many hours and getting away with it because of a lot of these things I'm talking about. But one day I noticed I was getting one of those muscle spasms where you can just tell if it goes, my whole spine's just gonna be contracted and it's gonna be weeks and weeks of pain. Has anyone gotten into one of those neck spasms? And then it's just really stuck for a while and really painful. I haven't had that happen in a long time, but I woke up a couple years ago and I was like, oh my gosh, I'm just about to be in big trouble. And I connected to my breath, got up, connected to the floor and walked down to make my tea very deliberately with this kind of like you were saying, you were going into the spontaneous fluid thing on the floor with that practice that you, this is it.

Speaker 3 (42:55):

This is what animals and primitive man did to wake it all up and blend it together. And I walked for a few minutes down to make my tea and this attunement to this micro movement and recruiting and what, what's going on in there? Really allowing my awareness to connect to every cell and in particular my back body. And it, it's like flipping a switch. Boom, we're on, we're good. Done. No neck thing happened. I basically could have been weeks of needing treatment, expensive and time consuming, looking for help outside of myself. Mm-Hmm. three or four minutes of conscious connection to your body and recruiting every muscle in particular your butt that solved it instantly. So awesome. That's a flock of birds flow. That's a flock of birds flow, behavior. And of course the fascia is almost like the holder of the whole thing. It's almost like the fascia kind of like activates the consciousness of, oh, I'm actually one substance. And the fascia sort of just connects it all together and holds the power and the integration. It's the support and the softness, the power and the softness at the same time. Because

Speaker 4 (44:13):

It has something called tensity, right? It's a liquid and solid. And so it's, isn't it really what keeps, when you're walking and your hand goes forward, it's what keeps your hand from flying off of your shoulder, isn't it? It keeps everything. Yeah. Because otherwise you'd be like a bag of jelly,

Speaker 3 (44:31):

Biotin, seg is exactly what I'm describing. It's another way of saying integration and the cooperation or integration's really the word, the flock of birds being all the parts of the body dropping into synchrony. And so the tensile aspects and then the structural aspects work together. It's this means we're a spring, that means we're everything's contained and this, this, the stability elements are bones are, are what allows support the fluid aspects to be free and melted. It's another way of saying integration. And it only comes through this splinting of the physical body and the subtle body. We can achieve this and not realize what we've done because, so oh, it's another brilliant thing I noticed that when we're in this three D glasses, the subtle body and the physical body blend again, the symphony is in tune. This is our fleck of birds state. The nervous system comes into balance. They mirror one another. Exactly. So if you can't yet feel your energy body, and believe me, I can relate, you will feel your nervous system responding to this blending of the physical and electrical aspects.

Speaker 4 (45:53):

Yes. There's so much to talk about with this. I'm creating a whole new program inside my other programs to start integrating, talking about fascia. I would love to have you come talk. Please tell me you have a blog or video somewhere on your website or YouTube about teaching people how to walk correctly.

Speaker 3 (46:11):

I have, do you I have gazillions of things. If you go to my website, flow is medicine.com. Mm-Hmm . Youll see a whole self study library. I have a YouTube channel. Okay. With tons of great things on it. I also have an ebook where I break down the tongue thing and I think I put the walking thing in there and the sitting thing, this, that thing you told me about you getting on the floor and dissolving into spontaneous fluid moment movement. Yeah, that's it right there. So I talk about what is that? How do we get there? How do we live there? And I can't stop talking about it. So I have a ton of videos, I have a ton of blogs there. I have an ebook and I, we actually have a flow school where we do it together once a week live on Zoom. And it's also a continuing medical education for doctors. So Awesome. Yeah. So the, all of that's so easy to find on flow is medicine.com and I'm really excited to hear about your program coming up and I can't wait to be a part of it if that's something that we, we could explore a collaboration on that. That sounds incredible.

Speaker 4 (47:23):

Yes, Dr. Michelle, it's, it's so great to have you on. I'm definitely gonna check out the resources. I hope some of you listening will join me in her online class 'cause it sounds super fun, educational and worthwhile for your health. Thank you so much for joining us. Any other information that you wanna share with everyone? Flow is medicine.com is where they can find you. Any other places online where you'd like them to know about connecting

Speaker 3 (47:50):

With you? I would love everyone to go to my courses page and sign up for even the free preview of what I'm doing because it's like a drip. I'm talking about some really powerful confronting things that will destroy your ego. Do not , I don't think. I don't know that, but, and self-care is an invitation, not an obligation. It's so fun once we get past that initial terror that you may or may not realize you have and then it's about building community. So even just going in and saying, I wanna learn more about this class and being in the loop to receive very few things I send out. But it's almost like, hmm, when the time is right, there'll be an email in your inbox and we'll just go with the flow

Speaker 4 (48:42):

And with the flow.

Speaker 3 (48:43):

I love it. Thank you

Speaker 4 (48:45):

So much for joining me today, Dr. Michelle. This has been an absolute pleasure and a gem. Thank you so much.

Speaker 3 (48:52):

Thank you for having me. Delighted

Speaker 4 (48:54):

And thank you all for joining me for another episode of the Hormone Prescription. This has been an amazing conversation. I know for some of you, a lot of this probably went over your head. Don't worry. Keep coming back. Keep listening. Check out Dr. Michelle's resources. It will make sense to you eventually and for some of you, this was right on point and you're gonna wanna know more. So you're going to want to check out her resources as well. Hopefully you are loving this new content that we are expanding and bringing to you 'cause it's really gonna help you with your hormones. We tied this a little bit into hormones today, but stay tuned for future episodes 'cause we'll be tying fascia more into hormones into your overall health and wellbeing. So

Speaker 2 (49:42):

I look forward to seeing you again next week. Until

Speaker 4 (49:44):

Then,

Speaker 3 (49:45):

Peace,

Speaker 2 (49:46):

Love, and hormones y'all. Thank you so much for listening. I know that incredible vitality occurs for women over 40 when we learn to speak hormone and balance these vital regulators to create the health and the life that we deserve. If you're enjoying this podcast, I'd love it if you give me a review and subscribe. It really does help this podcast out so much. You can visit the hormone prescription.com where we have some free gifts for you and you can sign up to have a hormone evaluation with me on the podcast to gain clarity into your personal situation. Until next time, remember, take small steps each day to balance your hormones and watch the wonderful changes in your health that begin to unfold for you. Talk to you soon.

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