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106 Surf Everyday Until Sponsored - Silas’s Bold Mission

 
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Michael Frampton and Surf Mastery Podcast द्वारा प्रदान की गई सामग्री. एपिसोड, ग्राफिक्स और पॉडकास्ट विवरण सहित सभी पॉडकास्ट सामग्री Michael Frampton and Surf Mastery Podcast या उनके पॉडकास्ट प्लेटफ़ॉर्म पार्टनर द्वारा सीधे अपलोड और प्रदान की जाती है। यदि आपको लगता है कि कोई आपकी अनुमति के बिना आपके कॉपीराइट किए गए कार्य का उपयोग कर रहा है, तो आप यहां बताई गई प्रक्रिया का पालन कर सकते हैं https://hi.player.fm/legal

Follow Silas on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/surfendipitous

What does it take to master surfing when you start late, face fear, and dive into the complexities of surf culture?

In this episode, Silas shares his inspiring story of committing to surfing at 19 and navigating the highs and lows of his journey. From mastering line-up politics to dealing with fear and embracing dry-land training, Silas offers a refreshing perspective on what it means to pursue passion while staying grounded in the realities of surf culture. If you’re looking to improve your skills or gain insight into the unwritten rules of the surf world, this episode is packed with practical tools and honest wisdom.

  • Learn how to approach line-up politics and navigate the culture shock of the surf world with respect and confidence.

  • Discover the benefits of dry-land training, video analysis, and unconventional balance exercises to improve your surfing skills.

  • Get actionable tips on conquering fear, entering a flow state, and even surfing through chandelier barrels with your eyes closed.

Take your surfing skills and understanding of the surf culture to the next level—listen now!

In this episode:

  • How negotiate line-up politics

  • How to deal with the surfing culture shock and

  • How to surf with your eyes closed - make a chandelier barrel section.

  • How and why to improve your balance and vision.

  • Tips for dry-land training

  • Practical tools to improve surfing skills, from dry-land training to video analysis.

  • Techniques for managing fear and entering a flow state.

  • The importance of respect and connection in surf culture.

  • How to set goals and define success on your own terms.

This episode provides actionable advice, personal inspiration, and insights into building a fulfilling surfing journey.

Key Takeaways from This Episode

  1. Rediscovering Passion

    • Silas shares how reconnecting with surfing reignited his sense of purpose and transformed his life.

  2. Overcoming Adversity

    • His journey from a challenging childhood to a dedicated surfer illustrates resilience and determination.

  3. Commitment to Improvement

    • Learn how coaching, video analysis, and consistent practice can accelerate skill development.

  4. Facing Fear and Embracing Flow

    • Silas offers strategies for confronting fear in the water and achieving the elusive "flow state."

  5. Purposeful Social Media Use

    • Gain insights into leveraging social media to document progress, create opportunities, and inspire others.

  6. Respecting Surf Culture

    • Tips on navigating local surf dynamics, building community respect, and thriving in new environments.

  7. Defining Success Your Way

    • Silas emphasizes growth, passion, and creating opportunities over conventional measures like sponsorships.

Outline

Early Surfing Experience

- Silas first tried surfing at age 4 with their mother, but had a negative experience due to salt water and tumbling waves, leading to a memorable fight with their mother.

- At age 12, Silas rediscovered surfing during a family vacation to Hawaii, falling in love with it again and deciding their dream was to become a professional surfer and marry a Hawaiian.

Challenges During Adolescence

- Between ages 12 and 19, Silas experienced difficult times at home, including issues with their mentally ill stepfather, which stunted their ability to pursue surfing.

Reigniting Passion for Surfing

- At age 19, Silas's cooking school instructor suggested they move to Tofino to surf, reigniting their passion.

- In Tofino, Silas got a job at a beach resort and began surfing intensively, teaching themselves initially before getting a surfing coach to improve further.

Social Media Challenge

- Silas started a social media challenge 73 days prior to the interview, posting a surfing video every day until they get sponsored, aiming to dedicate themselves more to surfing and improve their skills.

- Silas views social media as a tool for progress rather than having specific sponsorship expectations, seeing any opportunities arising from it as worthwhile.

Philosophy on Surfing Enjoyment

- Silas believes in the logarithmic nature of surfing enjoyment; the better one gets, the more fun it becomes exponentially.

- Silas aims to be around people who share their passion for surfing and making surf films, having recently lived a 'bum surfing lifestyle' to focus on the sport.

Inspiration and Goals

- Silas acknowledges starting surfing later than many but does not see it as a reason not to try, finding inspiration in surfers like Kelly Slater who continue to compete at an older age.

- Silas is open to various paths in surfing, not necessarily aiming for traditional pro surfing sponsorship but exploring different opportunities in the surfing world.

Training and Improvement Techniques

- Silas has found working with a coach and analyzing video footage to be the most helpful in improving their surfing.

- They practice pop-ups on dry land and have considered trying to surf goofy-footed based on viewer comments on their videos.

- Silas struggles with compression and getting low while surfing, recognizing it as an area for improvement.

- The interview discusses various training techniques, including practicing in front of mirrors, skateboarding with surfing techniques, and using slacklines for balance.

- Emphasis is placed on the importance of body awareness, balance, and vision training for surfing improvement.

Interacting with Other Surfers

- Silas finds interacting with other surfers in the lineup challenging, preferring to focus on surfing rather than socializing extensively.

- The transition from surfing beach breaks in Tofino to crowded point breaks in New Zealand was initially discouraging for Silas.

- The importance of being respectful in the lineup while still asserting oneself is discussed, along with the potential for relationships to develop over time with other surfers.

Surfing Philosophy and Overcoming Fear

- Silas emphasizes the value of surfing in all conditions, even when forecasts are poor, to maximize time in the water and improve skills.

- Silas identifies fear as a significant challenge in surfing, particularly in committing to waves in critical moments.

- They draw parallels between overcoming fear in surfing and staying present in the moment, similar to appreciating current progress rather than fixating on future goals.

Flow State and Future Plans

- The concept of flow state is discussed, with Silas relating it to experiences in both surfing and their work as a chef.

- The interview touches on the science of flow states and their relevance to surfing and other sports.

- Silas is planning to move to the South Island of New Zealand, particularly Dunedin and the Catlins, without a specific job lined up.

- They express a philosophy of making decisions and observing how their environment responds, following opportunities that seem to 'click into place'.

- Silas maintains an open mindset about their future, willing to embrace both positive and negative outcomes of their choices.

Transcript

Michael | 00:00

When did you start Surfing?

Silas | 00:02

Not until about two and a half years ago. Okay.

Yeah. So One of my earliest memories with my mom is a fight we had because she took me Surfing and I got up on a wave and she saw how lit up I was and how much I had just like, and maybe she hadn't seen that with other things because I was doing sports my whole life, all sorts of different sports.

Michael | 00:07

Where were you and why surfing?

Silas | 00:34

And when I fell and I got the salt water in my mouth and the tumbling of the wave, I did not want to do it anymore. I was out. I was like, no, get me out of here. And she wanted to make me keep doing it because she saw how much I enjoyed it. And I was like, no. And it was this like huge fight that I'll probably remember for the rest of my life.

And then I didn't touch it again until I was 12. We went on a family vacation to Hawaii.

So And then, yeah, when I was 12, we went on a family vacation to Hawaii and I did a lesson there and like really chill waves.

Michael | 01:01

How old were you when the first thing happened? Four. Four, okay, wow.

Yeah.

Silas | 01:16

And I like fell in love with it all over again. Like it was like, I completely forgotten that was, you know. And so I decided at the age of 12 that my dream was to become a professional Surfing and marry a Hawaiian. And so, yeah, that's loosely what we're going for in some sense, you know.

Michael | 01:44

Well, you made that decision when you were 12. Yeah. But you're not 14 now.

So what happened between 12 and? A.

Silas | 01:51

Lot, a lot of stuff happened, yeah. I went through some not so great things in like my home growing up and I had a lot of responsibility from a very early age. And I think when really bad things happen, it really stunts your ability and in most aspects of your life, you know, you kind of forget, get lost in the hurt and forget about the things that you love that, yeah. Especially at an early age, I think it's kind of hard to navigate your way through that without much experience, you know.

So yeah, I guess I just kind of got caught up in what was going on. And I was busy kind of providing opposed to just doing what I wanted to do and sticking true to that.

And then when I was 14, I served again in Hawaii and that kind of, again, almost got there, but not really. And then when I was finishing my cooking school to become a chef, my instructor was like, why don't you go move to Tofino and go Surfing? And he didn't know that I had surfed or, you know, anything. He just said it and this like lights was like switched on in my head. And I was like my God, like I have to do this.

Michael | 03:23

So how old were you when this happened? 19.

Yeah, okay.

Silas | 03:29

Yeah, like 18, 19. And so as soon as I was done my course, part of the requirements for the course is to work, I don't know, I think it's like 600 hours in the industry.

So I went and got a job in Tofino, which is the Surfing town. And at this five -star resort that was like right on the beach, they had staff accommodations.

So like two minute walk to the beach. And yeah, I just got after it.

Like I started charging, I bought like a nine foot soft top and like a shitty wetsuit. And I just started going out like past the break.

Like I had no experience really besides the one or two times I'd done it when I was younger. And I just started figuring it out.

Like I didn't really like, you know, have somebody like showing me the ropes. It was like, I was so eager and so keen and it was so outside of my comfort zone and I didn't care.

Like, and it's like a passion that I have that I don't have with anything else. Like there's no other thing in my life that drives me in that way, you know, that I've had this like such an intention for, feels like, you know. And from there, yeah, I just got better and better because I was going like every day.

And then it got to the point where I'd gotten a hard top. I think it was like a seven two and I see people doing turns and stuff. And I like, I know I want to get there, but I have no idea. And that was when I got a Surfing coach because I was like, I could consistently catch green waves and trim them nicely and ride them. And yeah.

Michael | 05:08

Okay, so you're 19 when you rediscovered Surfing and committed to it. Yeah. And so you're 21 now? 22. 22 now, okay.

So I'd be remissed if we skipped past that sore point we touched on. Did you lose a parent or something at 12 or? No.

Silas | 05:31

So my stepdad, he was quite a mentally ill person. I don't hold any like anger, hate towards him because he genuinely is like, he's in his own world.

You know, he's not capable of, but he was my dad growing up. Like he met my mom when I was two and he raised me like he was my dad.

Yeah. And they were married for 10 years. They had three kids together and all three of my siblings sort of have some sort of disability. And I didn't necessarily. And I received a lot of like hate from him without knowing why, you know?

Like it was like, because most of the time he was like the supportive, loving father. And then other times he would be like, I felt excluded all the time because like I wasn't his kid or whatever, but they didn't even tell me until I was 12.

So up until that point, I had thought that he was my real dad. And then they kind of broke it to me because you know, I'm a little bit darker than my siblings.

You know, I look different. And he would like Dall-E the N word when I was like growing up to like try and like make me feel bad about being different. And like, I don't even know why I'm different, you know?

So it was like always this, yeah, really not a nice game to play really. And, but they ended up splitting up and my younger brother, I have five siblings now. The one after me, he kind of got caught in the middle of it because it is actually his dad. And my stepdad kind of like twisted him up and like really messed his head up and just kind of like alienated him. And yeah, so, and yeah, my brother went to rehab like the week that I left for New Zealand.

So yeah, and it's been a struggle. And yeah, like that's my baby brother, you know, I had to watch him go through that. And I'd say that was probably the hardest thing about all of it was that there was nothing I could do.

Like I just had, I was helpless. I just had to watch it happen and there was nothing I could do. It was just the way it was. And it was really hard to come to terms with that and work through that mentally. And, you know, of course there's lots of, I could go on and on about the crazy shit that happened, but that's kind of the gist. And yeah, but like I know my birth dad now. I met him after. And yeah, we're really good friends and we've supported each other a lot since we've met and like made each other better.

You know, we were both very blunt people. And like, even though he didn't raise me, like we're like the same person. And it's so crazy to see like genetically because we're so similar. And I never knew him my whole life, but like when I met him, I was like, there is like somebody else that's like pretty similar to me out there.

Cause like I don't experience it a lot. It's yeah, like a genuine good connection that I find quite rarely.

Yeah. So to find that with my dad through like, but like in like a more of like a mutual kind of way opposed to like, he's my dad and I'm his son kind of thing, you know?

Yeah. Yeah.

Michael | 09:12

Well, thanks for sharing that. Yeah. It's not always easy.

Yeah. Like a little bit of experience. And my boys, their mother was quite mentally ill before she passed away.

So I had to deal with her and that sort of thing. My kids sort of went through, sounds like something a little bit similar to you, but different, but yeah, it's not easy, but it does.

Silas | 09:34

I'm so happy. Like I wouldn't trade my life or my experiences for anything.

Cause like I'll never ever be in as bad of a place as I was, you know? And I experienced that at an early age and that's like done. It's like only forward, you know, kind of feels like because yeah, it can't get much worse than that.

Michael | 10:00

I think it's a common thread between amongst a lot of great people is they have a traumatic childhood often. And it can go either way where you end up under a bridge with a needle in your arm or you can become one of the best in the world at something.

Yeah. And it looks like you've chosen the right path and hopefully your brother sticks with rehab and finds his way as well.

Yeah.

Silas | 10:24

And I've offered him that arm as well. Like when you're serious and you wanna come over here wherever I am and work, put your head down, like partying and like being a hooligan. I want that for you and I'm here for that. But until you're willing to take that seriously, I can't have you coming over here and like messing up what I have going for myself, you know? And it's really hard to create that boundary as well.

Michael | 10:50

Well, it's like those experiences can light fires and people and obviously it's lit a Surfing fire in.

Silas | 10:57

You. And he sees it too. And he's like, you know, he's, yeah, he sees it. And I think it kind of inspires him a little bit, you know? He's like, he's always like man, I wanna be out there, you know?

Like, yeah, so, yeah.

Michael | 11:11

Cool. And okay, so that, and then you rediscover Surfing at 19. You've stuck with it since.

And then I came across you through via Instagram. And it was, correct me if I'm wrong, but posting a surfing video every day until I'm sponsored. And that started about 70 days ago, was it?

Silas | 11:34

73 days ago.

Michael | 11:35

73 days ago. Okay. And we're two days before Christmas in December, 2024. And so what happened 73 -ish days ago?

Like what, why?

Silas | 11:50

Yeah, I've struggled on and off with social media. I see it as like a negative thing and I don't see it as something that's super beneficial and I've wasted a lot of time on it. And I kind of had a moment where I like redownloaded it and was like, you know, kind of like getting into posting stuff again. And I was like, you know, like, what am I doing?

You know, like, what's the goal here? Cause I'm not, I hate wasting my time. I really do. Not that I can't relax and enjoy doing nothing, but I don't like spending my time on things I don't think are gonna like, yeah. Benefit me.

So I just, I wanted to start posting content, but I didn't know what, but I'm Surfing every day and I've got this mouth mount for my GoPro. And I know that I want to go in the direction of dedicating myself more and more to Surfing and getting better. And I just kind of said, fuck it. I was like, yeah, I'm like, let's do it. Let's see what happens.

Like, you know, like I'm just gonna keep going. I don't care if I get to day 1 ,137, I'll do it.

Like, yeah. Okay.

Michael | 13:14

So, but what about the Surfing side of it? Like, and like, this is such a specific, like until I'm sponsored.

Silas | 13:24

Yeah. Well, I kind of like that it just says that because people automatically assume that I want to be like sponsored by a big company and like in that top tier of Surfing, I don't necessarily like need that or want that. That's not like the goal for me, but to get sponsored is very broad, you know? And I think it leaves opportunity for a lot of different things, opposed to being like, I just want one thing because I don't even know what that would be at the moment, you know?

So I think it's kind of nice to just leave it open -ended and like having people like you, like reach out and be like, you want to go on a podcast? That's not getting sponsored, but that's an opportunity and that's super cool, you know? And I think really anything that I get out of it is, yeah, totally worth it.

Yeah.

Michael | 14:20

Yeah. I mean, obviously you want to get better at Surfing.

Silas | 14:23

Yeah.

Michael | 14:24

Yeah. And you know, the better you get, the more fun it is.

Yeah. It's like a logarithmic thing, you know? The better you get, the more fun it is times 10 and that just keeps going.

Silas | 14:33

And going. Yeah, I make Surfing films and like that trip to Tahiti, there was just 10 of us and we were all surfers and videographers, you know?

Like I want that. I want to be around people who have that passion for Surfing as well as me. And I know that that's like the happiest I could be, you know, living that life. And I've been working part -time the last probably six months and just Surfing a lot. And it's been really good, but now I'm super broke and I'm like living in my van and I'm kind of living this like bum Surfing lifestyle. And it's what I wanted for my whole time in New Zealand, but I've only gotten a slice of it, but it's been pretty good.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm pretty stoked about it.

Yeah.

Michael | 15:24

It sounds like things are falling into place. Yeah. I think that's what's good about social media is it can be very inspirational.

Yeah. Like it does make me, do you follow Gravey at all? No. No? No. Do you know who he is? No. No? Okay, so gosh, I don't know his exact story, but I know that he's huge now.

Like he's probably one of the most popular Surfing.

Silas | 15:50

Okay.

Michael | 15:51

Yeah. He's a real stop. He's probably one of the most well -paid surfers.

Yeah. And he's a very average surfer.

Well, he's a good Surfing, but compared to a pro shortboarder, he doesn't come close. And he's made a following and a living out of sharing his journey. I think sobriety is how he sort of replaced drinking with Surfing basically. I may be misspeaking, so I don't know his exact story. And he surfs novelty waves. One of his goals was to surf every state in America.

So he's Surfing lakes and surfing rivers and chasing fairies on jet skis to surf the wakes off these big boats. And then he hooking up with Jamie O 'Brien, who's another sort of ex -pro who's gone massive with social media and that they're Surfing big waves and stuff.

So those guys who don't take the pro Surfing sponsored route, but end up being essentially sponsored surfers, they actually earn way more money. Yeah. And they don't have to be away from their family all the time, traveling on someone else's pro tennis tour schedule. Whilst it may be unrealistic when people first hear, I wanna become a sponsored Surfing, but I've only really started when I was 19. Because you're competing against rich kids that started when they were five. There's so many different ways to look at it.

Silas | 17:20

Yeah. I think because I started late, it's like, I understand the situation. I get it, but I don't think that means that I just shouldn't try. And I think Kelly Slater is super inspirational for me because he's still doing that at 50. And I figured, even if it takes me 10, 15 years, I'm here for it. And to be able to share that and be able to look back through all the progress is gonna be phenomenal.

Michael | 18:01

Yeah. I don't regret. You don't regret a Surfing. No. Even if it was a bad surf and something, you'd never regret going Surfing. And I think it's a worthy pursuit and it's something that even Kelly Slater himself still wants to get better. And there's people like Skip Fry who are in their 80s who still go Surfing every day. If you keep doing it, you can still... It's a lifelong pursuit basically.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think you sharing it on social media, it's inspirational. It's gonna be interesting to follow your journey. You've only just started. You get to that point where you've got a certain level of follows and it will sort of Yeah. It will take on a new form, I'm sure. And.

Silas | 18:50

Even if it doesn't, that's okay. You know, like I don't really have any, I don't know, like expectations or like dead set intentions. I'm just like putting it out there, you know? And seeing what happens.

Yeah. Kind of letting it just, instead of trying to like force it in one direction, you know, just like see where it takes me.

Yeah. Yeah. Just.

Michael | 19:18

Get better at Surfing. Yeah. Keep it simple. I like that.

Yeah. What's been, what's in the last, since you rediscovered surfing at 19, the last three years, what's been the thing that's helped you the most with Surfing? A coach.

Silas | 19:35

For sure. Yeah. Definitely a coach. And even just like video footage. I think those two things are very helpful. But it is interesting starting out because, you know, I feel like I've got to pick apart from what I'm learning, what I want to keep, what style, what's not, you know, and trying to like put all these things together is yeah, very difficult.

Yeah.

Michael | 20:05

Yeah. Yeah. And what else have you done? Do you do any, do you skateboard? Do you do anything else? No.

Silas | 20:12

I've Surfing skated a little bit. But I think it would be debatable on whether or not that's helpful. I'm practicing pop -up on dry land. That's really nice because it can always get better. And that video that got a lot of views, a lot of people thought I was switching, I was Surfing switch.

Yeah. So they're like, he's just like messing around and like serving switch. And I was like, no. And they're like, maybe you're a goofy footer.

So I haven't tried Surfing goofy ever, but I think I might give it a go just because enough people were like, kind of like, yeah, said that about that video. So maybe I'll give it a go because I can't even say that I'm not goofy because I haven't tried it, you know, I just naturally was regular. And I never even thought to like give goofy a chance, you know, yeah.

Michael | 21:11

It certainly wouldn't do any harm learning how to do it. No. Which way do you skate?

Silas | 21:18

I skate Mongo.

Michael | 21:21

No, but which foot forward?

Silas | 21:23

Left.

Michael | 21:23

Foot. Left foot forward, okay. And if you were to kick a football or soccer ball, which foot would you use? Right foot. You're probably a natural footer then.

Yeah. Yeah. It's just, I think when people first start Surfing, you have a, people sometimes it's called the poo stance.

And it's a more sort of, it's a more balanced, safe feeling position. Yeah.

And then once your balance and your comfort levels improve in the water, you sort of more, you gradually, your body relaxes and things sort of fall into place and you'd sort of develop your own style. There's a lot of reasons why that happens.

Silas | 22:06

I find that that's actually one of the things I've struggled with the most is my compression and getting down low. And I understand that's a problem that I have and I need to work on, but I still struggle like every time I get in the water to compress properly. Because I feel like I'm like all the way down, like super compressed.

And then I see video footage and I'm like, my knees are like a little bit bent. Like it's super difficult for some reason. And maybe it is like a safety thing or I don't know, but it's been hard for me to like, kind of like condition myself to compress.

Michael | 22:54

Yeah, what, I mean, from a technical coach's perspective, yeah, you're very, you don't bend at the hips, you bend at the knees a lot. So there's definitely some work to be done in that regards.

I mean, gosh, I mean, send an email to someone like Brad Gerlach. He does a program called Wave Key, which is all about refining your body position and technique on dry land. And ideally it's done in front of a mirror so that you're quite, how does my body feel? What does it look like? Those two things, as you know, when you watch yourself Surfing, they're so far apart. I thought I was doing this, but it looks like this and it's heartbreaking.

Yeah, It will be for a long time.

Silas | 23:33

Yeah, it is.

Michael | 23:36

Yeah. But if you start training in front of a mirror, then the way your body feels and the way it looks, those two things start to line, they start to line up more.

Yeah, that's interesting. And it increases your body awareness. It works on very ancient neurological things.

Like when we learn to walk, we actually learn by watching other people walk. It's called mirror neurons.

Silas | 24:01

Okay, yeah.

Michael | 24:01

So dry land training does work. Yeah, okay. Things like practicing skateboarding, using Surfing techniques whilst, it gets made fun of a lot and can look a little ridiculous. It does work. Do you know what I mean? Because not only are you working on those positions in front of a mirror, but then you're moving around on an uneven surface like a skateboard. Obviously it's not the same as Surfing, but you can kind of mimic surfing style on a skateboard. A lot of coaches swear by it and that's all they use.

So that's part of the reason why watching footage and training in front of the mirror helps a lot, because it just increases your body awareness so that you know, like if you were eyeing a barrel and you know it's X amount of size, then you know your body has to compress down and become that size in order to get into it. But if there's a mismatch and you're standing taller than you think you are to fit in the barrel, then the lips is gonna hit you in the head and you might not click as to why that happened. Little things like that can make a massive difference.

I mean, if I had my time all over again to sort of really attack Surfing, I would have spent more time just working on dry land stuff like body awareness, balance, vision.

Silas | 25:21

Slack line, Slack line's good. I like slack line. Slack line?

Yeah, slack line's nice. I thought because I could ride a surfboard that slack line should be no problem, you know? Because it seems like maybe simpler balancing on a Slack line because it's just there and you just walk on it. And I got on there and I was so frustrated that I couldn't do it. And it took me like a good like two or three weeks of, you know, just every time I walked past it, giving it a go. And the first time that I ever walked, like finished the Slack line was the day I got back from Tahiti. I had Surfing Taupo and I was like, looking at the Slack line, I was like, I can fucking do that shit. And I got on there and I smashed it. It felt pretty good.

Yeah, that's a good one for balance, I think. Yeah.

Michael | 26:11

Yeah, even just simple things like standing on one foot with your eyes closed. Something that sounds easy.

Silas | 26:18

I heard you can't do it.

Michael | 26:21

You might not be able to, but I mean, if Kelly Slater was here and he'd never done that, and he asked him to do it, he'd probably just do it without even, because he's so gifted with his neurological system. It's nothing. You have a vestibular system, which is kind of like a gyroscope in your inner ear. And that tells your brain, am I, is my head level, essentially. It senses movement.

You know, am I moving through space while it's happening? But your brain looks at your vision. Where's the horizon? What am I looking at? Am I moving to help decide whether you're balanced? And all the information coming from your body, your feet, your entire body awareness, that all of those inputs into the brain, am I balanced? It tells your body, are you balanced? The better each one of those things are, the better the combination of signals as well. You see surfers that surf through barrels like chandeliers, they can't see, but they still come out.

So all of a sudden their vision's gone, but they're still balanced because the body is so good with the other sensory inputs. So in training, we can isolate those. For example, standing on one foot with your eyes closed, sort of makes you, forces your brain to go, to only use your vestibular system and your body awareness to, am I balanced? And because we rely on vision so much, most people can't even do that.

Silas | 27:50

Yeah, like when, as soon as the water is in your eyes and you can't see, you just give up almost. It's like, that's it, game over.

Yeah, it's powering through, yeah.

Michael | 28:01

But there's so many things like that if you take a top athlete and get them to do it, they'll just laugh at you. I'm like, this is easy, give me something challenging. But most other people just can't do it.

So there's a big gap between elite athletes and average athletes. And I think, but the thing is, you can isolate those things and train them now. We know so much about the nervous system and athletic development now. And whilst it's dead lifting or doing Olympic lifting is, so, well, it looks so good on social media, right? Do you know what I mean? It's so, I wanna be big and strong and lift weights like that or whatever. But in reality, the pro athletes, they aren't doing much of that. They're actually doing a lot of other stuff and they're naturally gifted in other ways.

So you're actually better off, if you're really serious about becoming a better athlete, you're better off on working things like, on things like balance and body awareness, even the speed at which your eyes move from there to there, for example. Like if I'm looking down, I look what's in front of me, what's happening down there. If your eyes can literally move from looking down the line, see what that wave's doing to right in front of you, twice as fast and then back and then over there than anyone else, you're taking in more information than other Surfing. You're reading the wave on a more detailed level simply because your vision's better. And you make better decisions, time slows down, your body relaxes because you understand your environment more.

I mean, it's things like, even average surfers are doing a lot of big wave breath holding training. Even if they don't have the intention of Surfing big waves, the fact that the brain knows that you're comfortable with being underwater for a certain amount of time, every time you go Surfing from then on, from that training, you're just so much calmer, you're more relaxed because you're not subconsciously scared of drowning as much.

Yeah. Little things like that.

So this, anyway, I could go on and on. It's like.

Silas | 29:55

I've heard it before, like stacking the confidence, you know, like proving to yourself what you can do that's gonna help you out there. Yeah. And just collecting them as many as you can, yeah.

Yeah.

Michael | 30:09

Point is there's so much you can do because obviously with Surfing, you're limited to there being good waves and sunlight and time off work to go Surfing. Yeah. But there's so many other things you can do to get better at surfing, not necessarily directly from a skill perspective, but in terms of increasing the way your body works, your body awareness, your strength. And all those And just getting better at other sports.

Silas | 30:31

Things aren't limited to Surfing either. Exactly.

So it's win? Yes.

Yeah.

Michael | 30:39

You find a lot of athletes, they do a lot of other sports as well. And they're always busy, you know, pro Surfing, and they're at the golf course or they're playing table tennis or they're doing something else. No.

Silas | 30:52

I played a lot of sports. I did ice hockey for like eight years, did soccer, baseball, American football.

Yeah. Yeah. I was always playing sports. That was something I was super lucky to have growing up because I just naturally was fit growing up.

You know, it was never an issue.

Michael | 31:17

Do you still play any?

Silas | 31:19

No. Just Surfing? Just surfing.

Yeah. Yeah. It's, yeah, it takes the cake for sure.

Michael | 31:25

Yeah. Once you've got the bug.

Silas | 31:28

It's over. Yeah. I find one of the hardest things with Surfing for me is the people. I just like, I wanna go out there and I don't wanna interact, but I want to be interactive enough to be respectful. And like, you know, like I'm not out there to just like be the silent asshole who's like, you know, like lurking around. I just, I don't, I'm not there for that, you know? And it happens naturally. And when it does, it's great. But most of the time I'm not like going out with the intention of chit -chatting with somebody for 15 minutes while a bunch of waves go by, you know? I'm like, go. And I'm trying to paddle. And especially at a place like Manu where it's just so busy and there's so many people, you gotta be on, you gotta just go for everything and pick your moments and yeah.

Michael | 32:23

Yeah, that's, I think a lot of newbies to Surfing find that culture shock quite strange. Yeah. But it makes sense.

Like, because as a Surfing coach, coaching new beginners, it's one thing you have to deal with a lot because they just sort of, especially if you want to go out and Surfing a crowded lineup and get waves and not be ostracized for it or My advice is always be friendly to everyone, but don't expect them to be friendly back.

Silas | 32:48

Whatever.

Yeah, that's a good way to go about it.

Michael | 33:00

So acknowledge people. You might just give them a nod and they might not even look at you. You can't judge that person on that because they might have been Surfing for 20 years every day and that's their one hour a day where they don't want to talk to anyone. They just want to focus on Surfing. That's their life, that's their art form.

And then when you meet them in the car park, they're the nicest guy ever. But they might, as soon as they put a wetsuit on, so there can be exaggerated mismatches like that in.

Silas | 33:29

Surfing. And I think I've definitely, I don't know. I noticed it in my life as well. There's just some times where I draw negative attention from somebody and it's never out of a place where I intend to do so. It's always kind of like a, just like a weird, like one -off kind of thing. But I've, yeah, I've definitely pissed some people off in the lineup for sure. I had a dude in Kuatunu, he tried to like punch me in the water. And I've never experienced anything like that before. And Tofino, it's mostly beach break, so it's pretty spread out. And there's only a handful of like, you know, good Surfing.

So coming to New Zealand and Surfing my first point break with, you know, 40 people and, you know, at least half of them are really good or like, you know, pretty decent. It was, yeah, super challenging, like facing the fear of Surfing over shallow, you know, rocks and dodging 40 people is a very huge leap from the comfort of the beach break where I come from, because there I knew the beach so good and I'd Surfing it so many times. I could go out and like, you know, like a 12 to 14 foot storm swell by myself and I know I'm gonna be okay. But here it's just like it's a whole different ball game and I kind of did get shocked by it quite a bit. It was almost discouraging, almost. Yeah.

Michael | 35:09

That's almost, Surfing don't want you to be there because waves are a limited resource. However, having said that, if you prove to them that you can be respectful and that you are in it for the right reasons and that you can share waves, that person who was an absolute twat the first few times saw you, it might take a year, literally, of you Surfing with them every day, they're not even looking at you.

And then one day, they'll just, they'll acknowledge you one day and then you might end up being best friends. But it's sort of like, especially the older surfers, because Surfing used to be, gosh, even 10 years ago, the wetsuits weren't even that great. 15 years ago, the wetsuits weren't that great. And there was no forecasting. Do you know what I mean? I don't.

Silas | 36:03

Like forecasting. I don't like forecasting at all. I don't like the cams. I don't like the forecast. Because it's like, if you don't have cams and you don't look at the forecast and you just go look for yourself, even if it's shitty, probably gonna get in the water, opposed to looking on your camera on your phone and being like, it doesn't look perfect. I'm not gonna go. If.

Michael | 36:26

You're seriously about getting better, you'd Surfing every day at all conditions. And some of the best Surfing come from parts of the world where the waves are terrible. Kelly Slater comes from Florida.

Silas | 36:36

There's a kid that I Surfing with in rags. His name's DeMellon. That's his nickname. And we're usually the only two people out when there's a shitty wind swell and nobody else is in the water. And I'll be out by myself and then he'll paddle out or vice versa. And it's funny, because it's usually him.

Like on those shitty days when everybody's like, yeah, whatever. Yeah, it's usually me and him out there. It's pretty nice. I love Surfing shitty swell and then going into work and everybody's like, you surf? I'm like, yeah.

Like how was it? I was like, it's awesome.

Like what do you mean? Like, yeah. And they're like, it's supposed to be bad today.

Like, yeah. Waves are waves, you know? There's work to be done there. There's improvements to be made.

Yeah, always. And I understand that it all comes down to time in the water too. Yes. The more time you spend in the water, the faster you can improve.

So I definitely live by that in my routine and everything, for sure. Even on just like half foot days, borrow a friend's longboard and go and skim.

You know, like, yeah. I was trying to always, because.

Michael | 37:59

Always. You never regret a Surfing.

Yeah. No, you're right. You cannot beat time in the water just.

Silas | 38:07

And I've got a lot of catching up to do too. So it's like, it really, like, I've got that fire under me and yeah.

Michael | 38:14

Yeah. And even if you don't catch any waves, it's still worth it because you, pattern recognition, you're reading the ocean, you're trying to catch waves. You're, that wave did a weird thing.

And then you look, it was because it was this period. And then one day when it's pumping, you might get a little wind chop on the wave and you know how to negotiate it because you've Surfing so much junky conditions and you knew that was coming because you're so familiar with the break and you've seen that wave pop up in that weird place or whatever. And so your time in the water, you cannot.

Silas | 38:44

Substitute. I think that's hard as well though.

Like having the money to be able to travel and to Surfing different places is obviously like kind of like the surfer's dream to just like go to different countries and surf, you know, really nice breaks. But you don't get familiar with one place, you know, like staying in a place for a long time and getting really familiar with just one break.

So it's a lot of like, I feel like always kind of being sort of fluid in that sense of like, you never really know what you're getting kind of, you know, and like being in a new place at a break that you've never served with people who don't know you know. I feel like experiencing that over and over again, it's almost like the first time over and over again.

Michael | 39:41

Yeah. Yeah, you gotta have a home break.

Yeah. Obviously travels amazing and important.

Yeah, Yeah.

Silas | 39:46

Home break. Yeah, that's nice.

Yeah. I like that.

Michael | 39:49

Even if it's a different home break every year. Yeah.

Like, I mean, if I was you, I'd be emailing the Four Seasons in the Maldives saying, hey, do you need a sous chef?

Silas | 40:01

Yeah, to move to French Polynesia so bad.

Michael | 40:01

Yeah. I wanted.

Silas | 40:06

I told the guy on my way out of the country when he stamped my passport, I was like, I need to find a wife. And he's like, you'll find one in there. And he pointed to the waiting room. I was like, all right. Didn't find a wife though. Not yet.

Michael | 40:19

No. You said you wanted Hawaiian though. You gotta go.

Silas | 40:23

Hawaii. I'd settle for French Polynesia.

Yeah, I'd settle for French Polynesia. I think that'd be like I said, it's very loose, professional Surfing marrying a Hawaiian. It's just kind of like, yeah.

Michael | 40:36

Yeah, if you want to reach high, you've got to aim high.

Silas | 40:40

Yeah.

Michael | 40:42

Have you been to Hawaii?

Silas | 40:43

Twice, yeah. So once when I was 12 and that was when I went to Maui. Super beautiful, but pretty touristy and like American kind of modern.

And then Kauai. Kauai, I really loved Kauai. It's called the Garden Island.

Michael | 41:00

Yes, I've been there. Yeah, and.

Silas | 41:01

It's so good. All the jungle and like the localism. And yeah, I really liked it there. It did still have that touch of, you know, tourism for sure, but I found it a lot more enjoyable.

Like easier on the eyes, a little bit more friendly.

Michael | 41:20

Yeah, it's a gym. Yeah.

Yeah. You Surfing there?

Silas | 41:24

Yeah. I did a lesson and then I actually, I did really good on my lesson. And I thought the next day I'd take my, take an eight footer instead of a nine footer. And the swell had picked up as well. And I went back to the same beach and it was like, I didn't even recognize the beach because of how different it was. It had rained.

So all of the debris from the river had flowed into the water. So it changed the color of the water. And the waves were probably like four times bigger than when I was doing my lesson, you know?

So they look huge and I was like, okay, here we go. You know? And I was by myself and I just kind of sent it and I could barely balance on the eight foot. And I was like, what is this?

Like, it's only a foot of difference. Like how could it be that much less stable? Because on the nine foot, it's like a tank. It's like a rock. It's not going anywhere.

Yeah. And then I thought eight footer, surely eight footer, no problem. And I shocked myself. I was like, whoa.

Like, and I didn't catch a single wave that day because I was so uncomfortable and out of my depth, it felt like, and I tried to paddle for a wave, but I couldn't commit to it, you know? I was too scared. And that was at 14. And I think that's probably the hardest thing about Surfing is shutting the fear off. Hey, like you really have to like swallow it in that split moment, you know, when you go to catch a wave and you're looking down the line and then you see it, it's like that make or break moment.

Like you either gotta like take a breath and fucking go for it, or you just gotta, you know, pull out or eat shit or whatever it is. But it's so intense, that moment of just like letting it go and just going for it. It's unreal. And I'm familiar with the sensation from other aspects of my life, but not on that level of intensity. It's such a, yeah.

Michael | 43:27

Yeah, that's a big roadblock to people's development in Surfing is fear, whether they realize it or not. Yeah.

Yeah. It's good awareness though.

Yeah. You would have noticed it on steroids in Tahiti with the clear water and the shallow reef.

Silas | 43:44

Unbelievable to any, because I've only Surfing in like Canada, the water's not super clear. It's like dark blue, you know? And same with here in New Zealand, like you do get some clear days, especially on the East coast, but like on the West coast, usually it's pretty murky.

Yeah. And Tahiti, but Tahiti is like another level.

Like you're on the wave and you can't tell the middle of the wave from the bottom of the wave because it's so glassy see -through. And it's just like, yeah. Insane. And I think that trip was very substantial for me. It was very like a pivotal point for me because it was like, I can go and I can Surfing a wave like that. And I really did a lot better than I thought I would.

You know, like I took myself by surprise and I was just like, I just couldn't even believe it. It was like, yeah.

Yeah.

Michael | 44:45

So how did you overcome? How do you deal with fear?

Silas | 44:55

I think it's kind of similar to like instead of feeling like you're not where you're supposed to be or like you want to be somewhere, but you're not there yet. And instead of appreciating how far you've come to get where you are now, you're worried about the next thing. I kind of feel like it's similar to that.

Like every wave that I ever didn't take because I was scared, I regretted it. And it's like, it's such an in the moment thing, but to like be present enough to remind yourself that you can't listen to the fear is, I'd say is yeah, as difficult as staying in the present and not appreciating what you have and where you've come from opposed to where you want to be.

Michael | 45:51

Yeah. Yeah. It's essentially what it is being in the present moment.

Yeah. Because even if you were thinking half a second into the future while you're paddling into a wave, yeah, it's taking you away from.

Silas | 46:04

Every time like I go to do my pop -up and I'm already thinking about, you know, my first maneuver, I just lose it. It's, you gotta be just like, yeah, you've really gotta. And I think I've experienced moments in the kitchen where I'm on, like I'm in the zone, I'm in my flow state. It's happened like twice, you know, like it's, and I always try and like in those kinds of moments, like what was different? What did I have for breakfast that day?

You know, like what led to that? And it's an interesting dynamic in the kitchen as well, because you can enter the flow state as a team and not just in the kitchen, but, you know, in general.

So it's, yeah, it's a very interesting thing because it's attainable and there is a way to get there, but going through the trial and error of figuring out how to like always be there is super challenging and super frustrating because you know you can do it, but a lot of the time you just can't. Like that's what it feels like to me. It's It.

Michael | 47:10

Elusive. Yeah. Is. There's been some good books written on it though.

Like the Rise of Superman, great book. Actually, Stephen Kotler has written a couple of books. His most recent one is called Nah Country where he teaches himself and a bunch of older people, 50 plus I think, skiers to start park skiing.

Silas | 47:34

Just like normal skiers? Who's.

Michael | 47:37

Never skied a park and has never slid a rail or anything. Okay. And he teaches them how to do it. Cool. He taught himself how to do it. Everyone said, no, you're too old to learn how to park ski. What are you talking about? You break a hip. And he did that and he threw just, because you enter the flow state when you're being challenged enough to not be boring, but not so much that where you're gonna hurt yourself or you fail. It's that sweet spot. I think he says it's between three and 4%.

Yeah. Challenge, like it has to be a little bit harder than yesterday, but not so hard that you're just gonna fail or hurt yourself.

Silas | 48:17

And I feel like Surfing is all that, you know? Yeah. For.

Michael | 48:24

Sure, because even if you get the same waves every day, you can still surf deeper or you can always, yeah, it's like the wave is a Canva for whatever you wanna do on it, whether it's long board or short board or whatever. So yeah, that's a good awareness too, flow state stuff. There's plenty of reading to be done on that too. There's other things. He even started an institute, I forget what it's called, where they really studied flow states. And I think there's a list of 12 things that need to happen in order for you to increase the chances of entering flow state.

Silas | 49:02

Yeah, there's actually a girl in Raglan, I can't remember her name or the name of her company, but she does that. She does like flow state training, whatever that would entail.

Yeah, and immediately I just went to individualism, like she's doing one -on -ones with people. And I kind of said something that made it obvious that I'd made an assumption. And she was like no, like I do whole teams of people, like kitchens, she gave off a little list of environments that you would do that in. And it's quite interesting. Yeah.

Michael | 49:44

It's really fascinating, the flow state science. Yeah, I took a deep dive years ago and I learned a lot.

Yeah, I mean, that's key if you wanna... In Surfing, it usually sort of, it often just happens.

Silas | 49:58

Automatically. Yeah, naturally. But I think you definitely tell when it doesn't day. That day that I was out was probably the worst Surfing that I had in a really long time. And it was super big swell, a video that blew up. It was like, I was on the inside that wave that I caught. The ones out back were like twice the size and like super heavy. And there was so many like just balls in the air.

Like crazy, like good Surfing out there on their guns. I was on my little 5 '10 because my step up's out of commission. And I had like four hours sleep. I was like a little bit hungover, I think. And I just, my head was not there at all. It was a really tough day in the water for me.

And then it blew up for like no reason. And I was like, why?

Like why that day? You know?

Yeah, it's kind of funny. Yeah, ironic a little bit.

Michael | 50:58

Life is mysterious. Yeah. Especially Surfing.

So how long are you in Raglan for?

Silas | 51:07

I leave on the 7th of January, going down to the South Island. Yeah. I'm probably gonna spend most of my time in Dunedin and the Catlins.

Michael | 51:18

Yeah. Have you got a job down there? Not.

Silas | 51:20

Yet. Yeah, just winging it.

Yeah. I love it.

Yeah. And I don't even have like a financial cushion to wing it but I'm just gonna wing it anyways.

You know, like I Yeah.

Michael | 51:28

Just - You're young and single, who cares?

Silas | 51:31

But not even like that. I just, opposed to like trying to force things, I really like making decisions and seeing how my environment responds to me. Because like I said, when we were calling earlier, I just feel like sometimes you feel a lot of resistance when you make a decision or like, maybe some signs that it's not a good idea. And sometimes you make a decision and everything just kind of clicks into place, almost like a domino effect, like the shuffling of the cards, you know? And yeah, I'm just kind of following that.

Michael | 52:14

And - Awesome, I think you can do good, man. You can do fine. Hope so.

Silas | 52:17

Yeah. But if I don't, it's okay.

You know, I'm just here for it. Yeah. Good or the bad.

Yeah.

Michael | 52:23

Awesome. Tell us your Instagram handle.

Silas | 52:27

It is surfandipitous.

Michael | 52:30

Can you spell that?

Silas | 52:31

S -U -R -F -E -N -D -I -P -I -T -O -U -S. Yeah.

Michael | 52:40

I'll put a link to that in the show notes.

Silas | 52:42

Awesome. Yeah, I like it. It's like serendipity.

Yeah. It's a good thing. Surfing and surfing, I figured they go pretty good together. That's how I came up with the handle, yeah. Awesome.

Michael | 52:55

I love it. And I urge everyone to give you a follow and follow your journey. And I think there's a lot of my listeners will be interested to see what's possible. And, you know, I think we'll all be able to learn something by following.

Silas | 53:14

Nice. Yeah. I'm super excited. And thank you. Sweet. I appreciate.

Michael | 53:18

It. Sweet. Thanks for coming by. Yeah.

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Michael Frampton and Surf Mastery Podcast द्वारा प्रदान की गई सामग्री. एपिसोड, ग्राफिक्स और पॉडकास्ट विवरण सहित सभी पॉडकास्ट सामग्री Michael Frampton and Surf Mastery Podcast या उनके पॉडकास्ट प्लेटफ़ॉर्म पार्टनर द्वारा सीधे अपलोड और प्रदान की जाती है। यदि आपको लगता है कि कोई आपकी अनुमति के बिना आपके कॉपीराइट किए गए कार्य का उपयोग कर रहा है, तो आप यहां बताई गई प्रक्रिया का पालन कर सकते हैं https://hi.player.fm/legal

Follow Silas on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/surfendipitous

What does it take to master surfing when you start late, face fear, and dive into the complexities of surf culture?

In this episode, Silas shares his inspiring story of committing to surfing at 19 and navigating the highs and lows of his journey. From mastering line-up politics to dealing with fear and embracing dry-land training, Silas offers a refreshing perspective on what it means to pursue passion while staying grounded in the realities of surf culture. If you’re looking to improve your skills or gain insight into the unwritten rules of the surf world, this episode is packed with practical tools and honest wisdom.

  • Learn how to approach line-up politics and navigate the culture shock of the surf world with respect and confidence.

  • Discover the benefits of dry-land training, video analysis, and unconventional balance exercises to improve your surfing skills.

  • Get actionable tips on conquering fear, entering a flow state, and even surfing through chandelier barrels with your eyes closed.

Take your surfing skills and understanding of the surf culture to the next level—listen now!

In this episode:

  • How negotiate line-up politics

  • How to deal with the surfing culture shock and

  • How to surf with your eyes closed - make a chandelier barrel section.

  • How and why to improve your balance and vision.

  • Tips for dry-land training

  • Practical tools to improve surfing skills, from dry-land training to video analysis.

  • Techniques for managing fear and entering a flow state.

  • The importance of respect and connection in surf culture.

  • How to set goals and define success on your own terms.

This episode provides actionable advice, personal inspiration, and insights into building a fulfilling surfing journey.

Key Takeaways from This Episode

  1. Rediscovering Passion

    • Silas shares how reconnecting with surfing reignited his sense of purpose and transformed his life.

  2. Overcoming Adversity

    • His journey from a challenging childhood to a dedicated surfer illustrates resilience and determination.

  3. Commitment to Improvement

    • Learn how coaching, video analysis, and consistent practice can accelerate skill development.

  4. Facing Fear and Embracing Flow

    • Silas offers strategies for confronting fear in the water and achieving the elusive "flow state."

  5. Purposeful Social Media Use

    • Gain insights into leveraging social media to document progress, create opportunities, and inspire others.

  6. Respecting Surf Culture

    • Tips on navigating local surf dynamics, building community respect, and thriving in new environments.

  7. Defining Success Your Way

    • Silas emphasizes growth, passion, and creating opportunities over conventional measures like sponsorships.

Outline

Early Surfing Experience

- Silas first tried surfing at age 4 with their mother, but had a negative experience due to salt water and tumbling waves, leading to a memorable fight with their mother.

- At age 12, Silas rediscovered surfing during a family vacation to Hawaii, falling in love with it again and deciding their dream was to become a professional surfer and marry a Hawaiian.

Challenges During Adolescence

- Between ages 12 and 19, Silas experienced difficult times at home, including issues with their mentally ill stepfather, which stunted their ability to pursue surfing.

Reigniting Passion for Surfing

- At age 19, Silas's cooking school instructor suggested they move to Tofino to surf, reigniting their passion.

- In Tofino, Silas got a job at a beach resort and began surfing intensively, teaching themselves initially before getting a surfing coach to improve further.

Social Media Challenge

- Silas started a social media challenge 73 days prior to the interview, posting a surfing video every day until they get sponsored, aiming to dedicate themselves more to surfing and improve their skills.

- Silas views social media as a tool for progress rather than having specific sponsorship expectations, seeing any opportunities arising from it as worthwhile.

Philosophy on Surfing Enjoyment

- Silas believes in the logarithmic nature of surfing enjoyment; the better one gets, the more fun it becomes exponentially.

- Silas aims to be around people who share their passion for surfing and making surf films, having recently lived a 'bum surfing lifestyle' to focus on the sport.

Inspiration and Goals

- Silas acknowledges starting surfing later than many but does not see it as a reason not to try, finding inspiration in surfers like Kelly Slater who continue to compete at an older age.

- Silas is open to various paths in surfing, not necessarily aiming for traditional pro surfing sponsorship but exploring different opportunities in the surfing world.

Training and Improvement Techniques

- Silas has found working with a coach and analyzing video footage to be the most helpful in improving their surfing.

- They practice pop-ups on dry land and have considered trying to surf goofy-footed based on viewer comments on their videos.

- Silas struggles with compression and getting low while surfing, recognizing it as an area for improvement.

- The interview discusses various training techniques, including practicing in front of mirrors, skateboarding with surfing techniques, and using slacklines for balance.

- Emphasis is placed on the importance of body awareness, balance, and vision training for surfing improvement.

Interacting with Other Surfers

- Silas finds interacting with other surfers in the lineup challenging, preferring to focus on surfing rather than socializing extensively.

- The transition from surfing beach breaks in Tofino to crowded point breaks in New Zealand was initially discouraging for Silas.

- The importance of being respectful in the lineup while still asserting oneself is discussed, along with the potential for relationships to develop over time with other surfers.

Surfing Philosophy and Overcoming Fear

- Silas emphasizes the value of surfing in all conditions, even when forecasts are poor, to maximize time in the water and improve skills.

- Silas identifies fear as a significant challenge in surfing, particularly in committing to waves in critical moments.

- They draw parallels between overcoming fear in surfing and staying present in the moment, similar to appreciating current progress rather than fixating on future goals.

Flow State and Future Plans

- The concept of flow state is discussed, with Silas relating it to experiences in both surfing and their work as a chef.

- The interview touches on the science of flow states and their relevance to surfing and other sports.

- Silas is planning to move to the South Island of New Zealand, particularly Dunedin and the Catlins, without a specific job lined up.

- They express a philosophy of making decisions and observing how their environment responds, following opportunities that seem to 'click into place'.

- Silas maintains an open mindset about their future, willing to embrace both positive and negative outcomes of their choices.

Transcript

Michael | 00:00

When did you start Surfing?

Silas | 00:02

Not until about two and a half years ago. Okay.

Yeah. So One of my earliest memories with my mom is a fight we had because she took me Surfing and I got up on a wave and she saw how lit up I was and how much I had just like, and maybe she hadn't seen that with other things because I was doing sports my whole life, all sorts of different sports.

Michael | 00:07

Where were you and why surfing?

Silas | 00:34

And when I fell and I got the salt water in my mouth and the tumbling of the wave, I did not want to do it anymore. I was out. I was like, no, get me out of here. And she wanted to make me keep doing it because she saw how much I enjoyed it. And I was like, no. And it was this like huge fight that I'll probably remember for the rest of my life.

And then I didn't touch it again until I was 12. We went on a family vacation to Hawaii.

So And then, yeah, when I was 12, we went on a family vacation to Hawaii and I did a lesson there and like really chill waves.

Michael | 01:01

How old were you when the first thing happened? Four. Four, okay, wow.

Yeah.

Silas | 01:16

And I like fell in love with it all over again. Like it was like, I completely forgotten that was, you know. And so I decided at the age of 12 that my dream was to become a professional Surfing and marry a Hawaiian. And so, yeah, that's loosely what we're going for in some sense, you know.

Michael | 01:44

Well, you made that decision when you were 12. Yeah. But you're not 14 now.

So what happened between 12 and? A.

Silas | 01:51

Lot, a lot of stuff happened, yeah. I went through some not so great things in like my home growing up and I had a lot of responsibility from a very early age. And I think when really bad things happen, it really stunts your ability and in most aspects of your life, you know, you kind of forget, get lost in the hurt and forget about the things that you love that, yeah. Especially at an early age, I think it's kind of hard to navigate your way through that without much experience, you know.

So yeah, I guess I just kind of got caught up in what was going on. And I was busy kind of providing opposed to just doing what I wanted to do and sticking true to that.

And then when I was 14, I served again in Hawaii and that kind of, again, almost got there, but not really. And then when I was finishing my cooking school to become a chef, my instructor was like, why don't you go move to Tofino and go Surfing? And he didn't know that I had surfed or, you know, anything. He just said it and this like lights was like switched on in my head. And I was like my God, like I have to do this.

Michael | 03:23

So how old were you when this happened? 19.

Yeah, okay.

Silas | 03:29

Yeah, like 18, 19. And so as soon as I was done my course, part of the requirements for the course is to work, I don't know, I think it's like 600 hours in the industry.

So I went and got a job in Tofino, which is the Surfing town. And at this five -star resort that was like right on the beach, they had staff accommodations.

So like two minute walk to the beach. And yeah, I just got after it.

Like I started charging, I bought like a nine foot soft top and like a shitty wetsuit. And I just started going out like past the break.

Like I had no experience really besides the one or two times I'd done it when I was younger. And I just started figuring it out.

Like I didn't really like, you know, have somebody like showing me the ropes. It was like, I was so eager and so keen and it was so outside of my comfort zone and I didn't care.

Like, and it's like a passion that I have that I don't have with anything else. Like there's no other thing in my life that drives me in that way, you know, that I've had this like such an intention for, feels like, you know. And from there, yeah, I just got better and better because I was going like every day.

And then it got to the point where I'd gotten a hard top. I think it was like a seven two and I see people doing turns and stuff. And I like, I know I want to get there, but I have no idea. And that was when I got a Surfing coach because I was like, I could consistently catch green waves and trim them nicely and ride them. And yeah.

Michael | 05:08

Okay, so you're 19 when you rediscovered Surfing and committed to it. Yeah. And so you're 21 now? 22. 22 now, okay.

So I'd be remissed if we skipped past that sore point we touched on. Did you lose a parent or something at 12 or? No.

Silas | 05:31

So my stepdad, he was quite a mentally ill person. I don't hold any like anger, hate towards him because he genuinely is like, he's in his own world.

You know, he's not capable of, but he was my dad growing up. Like he met my mom when I was two and he raised me like he was my dad.

Yeah. And they were married for 10 years. They had three kids together and all three of my siblings sort of have some sort of disability. And I didn't necessarily. And I received a lot of like hate from him without knowing why, you know?

Like it was like, because most of the time he was like the supportive, loving father. And then other times he would be like, I felt excluded all the time because like I wasn't his kid or whatever, but they didn't even tell me until I was 12.

So up until that point, I had thought that he was my real dad. And then they kind of broke it to me because you know, I'm a little bit darker than my siblings.

You know, I look different. And he would like Dall-E the N word when I was like growing up to like try and like make me feel bad about being different. And like, I don't even know why I'm different, you know?

So it was like always this, yeah, really not a nice game to play really. And, but they ended up splitting up and my younger brother, I have five siblings now. The one after me, he kind of got caught in the middle of it because it is actually his dad. And my stepdad kind of like twisted him up and like really messed his head up and just kind of like alienated him. And yeah, so, and yeah, my brother went to rehab like the week that I left for New Zealand.

So yeah, and it's been a struggle. And yeah, like that's my baby brother, you know, I had to watch him go through that. And I'd say that was probably the hardest thing about all of it was that there was nothing I could do.

Like I just had, I was helpless. I just had to watch it happen and there was nothing I could do. It was just the way it was. And it was really hard to come to terms with that and work through that mentally. And, you know, of course there's lots of, I could go on and on about the crazy shit that happened, but that's kind of the gist. And yeah, but like I know my birth dad now. I met him after. And yeah, we're really good friends and we've supported each other a lot since we've met and like made each other better.

You know, we were both very blunt people. And like, even though he didn't raise me, like we're like the same person. And it's so crazy to see like genetically because we're so similar. And I never knew him my whole life, but like when I met him, I was like, there is like somebody else that's like pretty similar to me out there.

Cause like I don't experience it a lot. It's yeah, like a genuine good connection that I find quite rarely.

Yeah. So to find that with my dad through like, but like in like a more of like a mutual kind of way opposed to like, he's my dad and I'm his son kind of thing, you know?

Yeah. Yeah.

Michael | 09:12

Well, thanks for sharing that. Yeah. It's not always easy.

Yeah. Like a little bit of experience. And my boys, their mother was quite mentally ill before she passed away.

So I had to deal with her and that sort of thing. My kids sort of went through, sounds like something a little bit similar to you, but different, but yeah, it's not easy, but it does.

Silas | 09:34

I'm so happy. Like I wouldn't trade my life or my experiences for anything.

Cause like I'll never ever be in as bad of a place as I was, you know? And I experienced that at an early age and that's like done. It's like only forward, you know, kind of feels like because yeah, it can't get much worse than that.

Michael | 10:00

I think it's a common thread between amongst a lot of great people is they have a traumatic childhood often. And it can go either way where you end up under a bridge with a needle in your arm or you can become one of the best in the world at something.

Yeah. And it looks like you've chosen the right path and hopefully your brother sticks with rehab and finds his way as well.

Yeah.

Silas | 10:24

And I've offered him that arm as well. Like when you're serious and you wanna come over here wherever I am and work, put your head down, like partying and like being a hooligan. I want that for you and I'm here for that. But until you're willing to take that seriously, I can't have you coming over here and like messing up what I have going for myself, you know? And it's really hard to create that boundary as well.

Michael | 10:50

Well, it's like those experiences can light fires and people and obviously it's lit a Surfing fire in.

Silas | 10:57

You. And he sees it too. And he's like, you know, he's, yeah, he sees it. And I think it kind of inspires him a little bit, you know? He's like, he's always like man, I wanna be out there, you know?

Like, yeah, so, yeah.

Michael | 11:11

Cool. And okay, so that, and then you rediscover Surfing at 19. You've stuck with it since.

And then I came across you through via Instagram. And it was, correct me if I'm wrong, but posting a surfing video every day until I'm sponsored. And that started about 70 days ago, was it?

Silas | 11:34

73 days ago.

Michael | 11:35

73 days ago. Okay. And we're two days before Christmas in December, 2024. And so what happened 73 -ish days ago?

Like what, why?

Silas | 11:50

Yeah, I've struggled on and off with social media. I see it as like a negative thing and I don't see it as something that's super beneficial and I've wasted a lot of time on it. And I kind of had a moment where I like redownloaded it and was like, you know, kind of like getting into posting stuff again. And I was like, you know, like, what am I doing?

You know, like, what's the goal here? Cause I'm not, I hate wasting my time. I really do. Not that I can't relax and enjoy doing nothing, but I don't like spending my time on things I don't think are gonna like, yeah. Benefit me.

So I just, I wanted to start posting content, but I didn't know what, but I'm Surfing every day and I've got this mouth mount for my GoPro. And I know that I want to go in the direction of dedicating myself more and more to Surfing and getting better. And I just kind of said, fuck it. I was like, yeah, I'm like, let's do it. Let's see what happens.

Like, you know, like I'm just gonna keep going. I don't care if I get to day 1 ,137, I'll do it.

Like, yeah. Okay.

Michael | 13:14

So, but what about the Surfing side of it? Like, and like, this is such a specific, like until I'm sponsored.

Silas | 13:24

Yeah. Well, I kind of like that it just says that because people automatically assume that I want to be like sponsored by a big company and like in that top tier of Surfing, I don't necessarily like need that or want that. That's not like the goal for me, but to get sponsored is very broad, you know? And I think it leaves opportunity for a lot of different things, opposed to being like, I just want one thing because I don't even know what that would be at the moment, you know?

So I think it's kind of nice to just leave it open -ended and like having people like you, like reach out and be like, you want to go on a podcast? That's not getting sponsored, but that's an opportunity and that's super cool, you know? And I think really anything that I get out of it is, yeah, totally worth it.

Yeah.

Michael | 14:20

Yeah. I mean, obviously you want to get better at Surfing.

Silas | 14:23

Yeah.

Michael | 14:24

Yeah. And you know, the better you get, the more fun it is.

Yeah. It's like a logarithmic thing, you know? The better you get, the more fun it is times 10 and that just keeps going.

Silas | 14:33

And going. Yeah, I make Surfing films and like that trip to Tahiti, there was just 10 of us and we were all surfers and videographers, you know?

Like I want that. I want to be around people who have that passion for Surfing as well as me. And I know that that's like the happiest I could be, you know, living that life. And I've been working part -time the last probably six months and just Surfing a lot. And it's been really good, but now I'm super broke and I'm like living in my van and I'm kind of living this like bum Surfing lifestyle. And it's what I wanted for my whole time in New Zealand, but I've only gotten a slice of it, but it's been pretty good.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I'm pretty stoked about it.

Yeah.

Michael | 15:24

It sounds like things are falling into place. Yeah. I think that's what's good about social media is it can be very inspirational.

Yeah. Like it does make me, do you follow Gravey at all? No. No? No. Do you know who he is? No. No? Okay, so gosh, I don't know his exact story, but I know that he's huge now.

Like he's probably one of the most popular Surfing.

Silas | 15:50

Okay.

Michael | 15:51

Yeah. He's a real stop. He's probably one of the most well -paid surfers.

Yeah. And he's a very average surfer.

Well, he's a good Surfing, but compared to a pro shortboarder, he doesn't come close. And he's made a following and a living out of sharing his journey. I think sobriety is how he sort of replaced drinking with Surfing basically. I may be misspeaking, so I don't know his exact story. And he surfs novelty waves. One of his goals was to surf every state in America.

So he's Surfing lakes and surfing rivers and chasing fairies on jet skis to surf the wakes off these big boats. And then he hooking up with Jamie O 'Brien, who's another sort of ex -pro who's gone massive with social media and that they're Surfing big waves and stuff.

So those guys who don't take the pro Surfing sponsored route, but end up being essentially sponsored surfers, they actually earn way more money. Yeah. And they don't have to be away from their family all the time, traveling on someone else's pro tennis tour schedule. Whilst it may be unrealistic when people first hear, I wanna become a sponsored Surfing, but I've only really started when I was 19. Because you're competing against rich kids that started when they were five. There's so many different ways to look at it.

Silas | 17:20

Yeah. I think because I started late, it's like, I understand the situation. I get it, but I don't think that means that I just shouldn't try. And I think Kelly Slater is super inspirational for me because he's still doing that at 50. And I figured, even if it takes me 10, 15 years, I'm here for it. And to be able to share that and be able to look back through all the progress is gonna be phenomenal.

Michael | 18:01

Yeah. I don't regret. You don't regret a Surfing. No. Even if it was a bad surf and something, you'd never regret going Surfing. And I think it's a worthy pursuit and it's something that even Kelly Slater himself still wants to get better. And there's people like Skip Fry who are in their 80s who still go Surfing every day. If you keep doing it, you can still... It's a lifelong pursuit basically.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think you sharing it on social media, it's inspirational. It's gonna be interesting to follow your journey. You've only just started. You get to that point where you've got a certain level of follows and it will sort of Yeah. It will take on a new form, I'm sure. And.

Silas | 18:50

Even if it doesn't, that's okay. You know, like I don't really have any, I don't know, like expectations or like dead set intentions. I'm just like putting it out there, you know? And seeing what happens.

Yeah. Kind of letting it just, instead of trying to like force it in one direction, you know, just like see where it takes me.

Yeah. Yeah. Just.

Michael | 19:18

Get better at Surfing. Yeah. Keep it simple. I like that.

Yeah. What's been, what's in the last, since you rediscovered surfing at 19, the last three years, what's been the thing that's helped you the most with Surfing? A coach.

Silas | 19:35

For sure. Yeah. Definitely a coach. And even just like video footage. I think those two things are very helpful. But it is interesting starting out because, you know, I feel like I've got to pick apart from what I'm learning, what I want to keep, what style, what's not, you know, and trying to like put all these things together is yeah, very difficult.

Yeah.

Michael | 20:05

Yeah. Yeah. And what else have you done? Do you do any, do you skateboard? Do you do anything else? No.

Silas | 20:12

I've Surfing skated a little bit. But I think it would be debatable on whether or not that's helpful. I'm practicing pop -up on dry land. That's really nice because it can always get better. And that video that got a lot of views, a lot of people thought I was switching, I was Surfing switch.

Yeah. So they're like, he's just like messing around and like serving switch. And I was like, no. And they're like, maybe you're a goofy footer.

So I haven't tried Surfing goofy ever, but I think I might give it a go just because enough people were like, kind of like, yeah, said that about that video. So maybe I'll give it a go because I can't even say that I'm not goofy because I haven't tried it, you know, I just naturally was regular. And I never even thought to like give goofy a chance, you know, yeah.

Michael | 21:11

It certainly wouldn't do any harm learning how to do it. No. Which way do you skate?

Silas | 21:18

I skate Mongo.

Michael | 21:21

No, but which foot forward?

Silas | 21:23

Left.

Michael | 21:23

Foot. Left foot forward, okay. And if you were to kick a football or soccer ball, which foot would you use? Right foot. You're probably a natural footer then.

Yeah. Yeah. It's just, I think when people first start Surfing, you have a, people sometimes it's called the poo stance.

And it's a more sort of, it's a more balanced, safe feeling position. Yeah.

And then once your balance and your comfort levels improve in the water, you sort of more, you gradually, your body relaxes and things sort of fall into place and you'd sort of develop your own style. There's a lot of reasons why that happens.

Silas | 22:06

I find that that's actually one of the things I've struggled with the most is my compression and getting down low. And I understand that's a problem that I have and I need to work on, but I still struggle like every time I get in the water to compress properly. Because I feel like I'm like all the way down, like super compressed.

And then I see video footage and I'm like, my knees are like a little bit bent. Like it's super difficult for some reason. And maybe it is like a safety thing or I don't know, but it's been hard for me to like, kind of like condition myself to compress.

Michael | 22:54

Yeah, what, I mean, from a technical coach's perspective, yeah, you're very, you don't bend at the hips, you bend at the knees a lot. So there's definitely some work to be done in that regards.

I mean, gosh, I mean, send an email to someone like Brad Gerlach. He does a program called Wave Key, which is all about refining your body position and technique on dry land. And ideally it's done in front of a mirror so that you're quite, how does my body feel? What does it look like? Those two things, as you know, when you watch yourself Surfing, they're so far apart. I thought I was doing this, but it looks like this and it's heartbreaking.

Yeah, It will be for a long time.

Silas | 23:33

Yeah, it is.

Michael | 23:36

Yeah. But if you start training in front of a mirror, then the way your body feels and the way it looks, those two things start to line, they start to line up more.

Yeah, that's interesting. And it increases your body awareness. It works on very ancient neurological things.

Like when we learn to walk, we actually learn by watching other people walk. It's called mirror neurons.

Silas | 24:01

Okay, yeah.

Michael | 24:01

So dry land training does work. Yeah, okay. Things like practicing skateboarding, using Surfing techniques whilst, it gets made fun of a lot and can look a little ridiculous. It does work. Do you know what I mean? Because not only are you working on those positions in front of a mirror, but then you're moving around on an uneven surface like a skateboard. Obviously it's not the same as Surfing, but you can kind of mimic surfing style on a skateboard. A lot of coaches swear by it and that's all they use.

So that's part of the reason why watching footage and training in front of the mirror helps a lot, because it just increases your body awareness so that you know, like if you were eyeing a barrel and you know it's X amount of size, then you know your body has to compress down and become that size in order to get into it. But if there's a mismatch and you're standing taller than you think you are to fit in the barrel, then the lips is gonna hit you in the head and you might not click as to why that happened. Little things like that can make a massive difference.

I mean, if I had my time all over again to sort of really attack Surfing, I would have spent more time just working on dry land stuff like body awareness, balance, vision.

Silas | 25:21

Slack line, Slack line's good. I like slack line. Slack line?

Yeah, slack line's nice. I thought because I could ride a surfboard that slack line should be no problem, you know? Because it seems like maybe simpler balancing on a Slack line because it's just there and you just walk on it. And I got on there and I was so frustrated that I couldn't do it. And it took me like a good like two or three weeks of, you know, just every time I walked past it, giving it a go. And the first time that I ever walked, like finished the Slack line was the day I got back from Tahiti. I had Surfing Taupo and I was like, looking at the Slack line, I was like, I can fucking do that shit. And I got on there and I smashed it. It felt pretty good.

Yeah, that's a good one for balance, I think. Yeah.

Michael | 26:11

Yeah, even just simple things like standing on one foot with your eyes closed. Something that sounds easy.

Silas | 26:18

I heard you can't do it.

Michael | 26:21

You might not be able to, but I mean, if Kelly Slater was here and he'd never done that, and he asked him to do it, he'd probably just do it without even, because he's so gifted with his neurological system. It's nothing. You have a vestibular system, which is kind of like a gyroscope in your inner ear. And that tells your brain, am I, is my head level, essentially. It senses movement.

You know, am I moving through space while it's happening? But your brain looks at your vision. Where's the horizon? What am I looking at? Am I moving to help decide whether you're balanced? And all the information coming from your body, your feet, your entire body awareness, that all of those inputs into the brain, am I balanced? It tells your body, are you balanced? The better each one of those things are, the better the combination of signals as well. You see surfers that surf through barrels like chandeliers, they can't see, but they still come out.

So all of a sudden their vision's gone, but they're still balanced because the body is so good with the other sensory inputs. So in training, we can isolate those. For example, standing on one foot with your eyes closed, sort of makes you, forces your brain to go, to only use your vestibular system and your body awareness to, am I balanced? And because we rely on vision so much, most people can't even do that.

Silas | 27:50

Yeah, like when, as soon as the water is in your eyes and you can't see, you just give up almost. It's like, that's it, game over.

Yeah, it's powering through, yeah.

Michael | 28:01

But there's so many things like that if you take a top athlete and get them to do it, they'll just laugh at you. I'm like, this is easy, give me something challenging. But most other people just can't do it.

So there's a big gap between elite athletes and average athletes. And I think, but the thing is, you can isolate those things and train them now. We know so much about the nervous system and athletic development now. And whilst it's dead lifting or doing Olympic lifting is, so, well, it looks so good on social media, right? Do you know what I mean? It's so, I wanna be big and strong and lift weights like that or whatever. But in reality, the pro athletes, they aren't doing much of that. They're actually doing a lot of other stuff and they're naturally gifted in other ways.

So you're actually better off, if you're really serious about becoming a better athlete, you're better off on working things like, on things like balance and body awareness, even the speed at which your eyes move from there to there, for example. Like if I'm looking down, I look what's in front of me, what's happening down there. If your eyes can literally move from looking down the line, see what that wave's doing to right in front of you, twice as fast and then back and then over there than anyone else, you're taking in more information than other Surfing. You're reading the wave on a more detailed level simply because your vision's better. And you make better decisions, time slows down, your body relaxes because you understand your environment more.

I mean, it's things like, even average surfers are doing a lot of big wave breath holding training. Even if they don't have the intention of Surfing big waves, the fact that the brain knows that you're comfortable with being underwater for a certain amount of time, every time you go Surfing from then on, from that training, you're just so much calmer, you're more relaxed because you're not subconsciously scared of drowning as much.

Yeah. Little things like that.

So this, anyway, I could go on and on. It's like.

Silas | 29:55

I've heard it before, like stacking the confidence, you know, like proving to yourself what you can do that's gonna help you out there. Yeah. And just collecting them as many as you can, yeah.

Yeah.

Michael | 30:09

Point is there's so much you can do because obviously with Surfing, you're limited to there being good waves and sunlight and time off work to go Surfing. Yeah. But there's so many other things you can do to get better at surfing, not necessarily directly from a skill perspective, but in terms of increasing the way your body works, your body awareness, your strength. And all those And just getting better at other sports.

Silas | 30:31

Things aren't limited to Surfing either. Exactly.

So it's win? Yes.

Yeah.

Michael | 30:39

You find a lot of athletes, they do a lot of other sports as well. And they're always busy, you know, pro Surfing, and they're at the golf course or they're playing table tennis or they're doing something else. No.

Silas | 30:52

I played a lot of sports. I did ice hockey for like eight years, did soccer, baseball, American football.

Yeah. Yeah. I was always playing sports. That was something I was super lucky to have growing up because I just naturally was fit growing up.

You know, it was never an issue.

Michael | 31:17

Do you still play any?

Silas | 31:19

No. Just Surfing? Just surfing.

Yeah. Yeah. It's, yeah, it takes the cake for sure.

Michael | 31:25

Yeah. Once you've got the bug.

Silas | 31:28

It's over. Yeah. I find one of the hardest things with Surfing for me is the people. I just like, I wanna go out there and I don't wanna interact, but I want to be interactive enough to be respectful. And like, you know, like I'm not out there to just like be the silent asshole who's like, you know, like lurking around. I just, I don't, I'm not there for that, you know? And it happens naturally. And when it does, it's great. But most of the time I'm not like going out with the intention of chit -chatting with somebody for 15 minutes while a bunch of waves go by, you know? I'm like, go. And I'm trying to paddle. And especially at a place like Manu where it's just so busy and there's so many people, you gotta be on, you gotta just go for everything and pick your moments and yeah.

Michael | 32:23

Yeah, that's, I think a lot of newbies to Surfing find that culture shock quite strange. Yeah. But it makes sense.

Like, because as a Surfing coach, coaching new beginners, it's one thing you have to deal with a lot because they just sort of, especially if you want to go out and Surfing a crowded lineup and get waves and not be ostracized for it or My advice is always be friendly to everyone, but don't expect them to be friendly back.

Silas | 32:48

Whatever.

Yeah, that's a good way to go about it.

Michael | 33:00

So acknowledge people. You might just give them a nod and they might not even look at you. You can't judge that person on that because they might have been Surfing for 20 years every day and that's their one hour a day where they don't want to talk to anyone. They just want to focus on Surfing. That's their life, that's their art form.

And then when you meet them in the car park, they're the nicest guy ever. But they might, as soon as they put a wetsuit on, so there can be exaggerated mismatches like that in.

Silas | 33:29

Surfing. And I think I've definitely, I don't know. I noticed it in my life as well. There's just some times where I draw negative attention from somebody and it's never out of a place where I intend to do so. It's always kind of like a, just like a weird, like one -off kind of thing. But I've, yeah, I've definitely pissed some people off in the lineup for sure. I had a dude in Kuatunu, he tried to like punch me in the water. And I've never experienced anything like that before. And Tofino, it's mostly beach break, so it's pretty spread out. And there's only a handful of like, you know, good Surfing.

So coming to New Zealand and Surfing my first point break with, you know, 40 people and, you know, at least half of them are really good or like, you know, pretty decent. It was, yeah, super challenging, like facing the fear of Surfing over shallow, you know, rocks and dodging 40 people is a very huge leap from the comfort of the beach break where I come from, because there I knew the beach so good and I'd Surfing it so many times. I could go out and like, you know, like a 12 to 14 foot storm swell by myself and I know I'm gonna be okay. But here it's just like it's a whole different ball game and I kind of did get shocked by it quite a bit. It was almost discouraging, almost. Yeah.

Michael | 35:09

That's almost, Surfing don't want you to be there because waves are a limited resource. However, having said that, if you prove to them that you can be respectful and that you are in it for the right reasons and that you can share waves, that person who was an absolute twat the first few times saw you, it might take a year, literally, of you Surfing with them every day, they're not even looking at you.

And then one day, they'll just, they'll acknowledge you one day and then you might end up being best friends. But it's sort of like, especially the older surfers, because Surfing used to be, gosh, even 10 years ago, the wetsuits weren't even that great. 15 years ago, the wetsuits weren't that great. And there was no forecasting. Do you know what I mean? I don't.

Silas | 36:03

Like forecasting. I don't like forecasting at all. I don't like the cams. I don't like the forecast. Because it's like, if you don't have cams and you don't look at the forecast and you just go look for yourself, even if it's shitty, probably gonna get in the water, opposed to looking on your camera on your phone and being like, it doesn't look perfect. I'm not gonna go. If.

Michael | 36:26

You're seriously about getting better, you'd Surfing every day at all conditions. And some of the best Surfing come from parts of the world where the waves are terrible. Kelly Slater comes from Florida.

Silas | 36:36

There's a kid that I Surfing with in rags. His name's DeMellon. That's his nickname. And we're usually the only two people out when there's a shitty wind swell and nobody else is in the water. And I'll be out by myself and then he'll paddle out or vice versa. And it's funny, because it's usually him.

Like on those shitty days when everybody's like, yeah, whatever. Yeah, it's usually me and him out there. It's pretty nice. I love Surfing shitty swell and then going into work and everybody's like, you surf? I'm like, yeah.

Like how was it? I was like, it's awesome.

Like what do you mean? Like, yeah. And they're like, it's supposed to be bad today.

Like, yeah. Waves are waves, you know? There's work to be done there. There's improvements to be made.

Yeah, always. And I understand that it all comes down to time in the water too. Yes. The more time you spend in the water, the faster you can improve.

So I definitely live by that in my routine and everything, for sure. Even on just like half foot days, borrow a friend's longboard and go and skim.

You know, like, yeah. I was trying to always, because.

Michael | 37:59

Always. You never regret a Surfing.

Yeah. No, you're right. You cannot beat time in the water just.

Silas | 38:07

And I've got a lot of catching up to do too. So it's like, it really, like, I've got that fire under me and yeah.

Michael | 38:14

Yeah. And even if you don't catch any waves, it's still worth it because you, pattern recognition, you're reading the ocean, you're trying to catch waves. You're, that wave did a weird thing.

And then you look, it was because it was this period. And then one day when it's pumping, you might get a little wind chop on the wave and you know how to negotiate it because you've Surfing so much junky conditions and you knew that was coming because you're so familiar with the break and you've seen that wave pop up in that weird place or whatever. And so your time in the water, you cannot.

Silas | 38:44

Substitute. I think that's hard as well though.

Like having the money to be able to travel and to Surfing different places is obviously like kind of like the surfer's dream to just like go to different countries and surf, you know, really nice breaks. But you don't get familiar with one place, you know, like staying in a place for a long time and getting really familiar with just one break.

So it's a lot of like, I feel like always kind of being sort of fluid in that sense of like, you never really know what you're getting kind of, you know, and like being in a new place at a break that you've never served with people who don't know you know. I feel like experiencing that over and over again, it's almost like the first time over and over again.

Michael | 39:41

Yeah. Yeah, you gotta have a home break.

Yeah. Obviously travels amazing and important.

Yeah, Yeah.

Silas | 39:46

Home break. Yeah, that's nice.

Yeah. I like that.

Michael | 39:49

Even if it's a different home break every year. Yeah.

Like, I mean, if I was you, I'd be emailing the Four Seasons in the Maldives saying, hey, do you need a sous chef?

Silas | 40:01

Yeah, to move to French Polynesia so bad.

Michael | 40:01

Yeah. I wanted.

Silas | 40:06

I told the guy on my way out of the country when he stamped my passport, I was like, I need to find a wife. And he's like, you'll find one in there. And he pointed to the waiting room. I was like, all right. Didn't find a wife though. Not yet.

Michael | 40:19

No. You said you wanted Hawaiian though. You gotta go.

Silas | 40:23

Hawaii. I'd settle for French Polynesia.

Yeah, I'd settle for French Polynesia. I think that'd be like I said, it's very loose, professional Surfing marrying a Hawaiian. It's just kind of like, yeah.

Michael | 40:36

Yeah, if you want to reach high, you've got to aim high.

Silas | 40:40

Yeah.

Michael | 40:42

Have you been to Hawaii?

Silas | 40:43

Twice, yeah. So once when I was 12 and that was when I went to Maui. Super beautiful, but pretty touristy and like American kind of modern.

And then Kauai. Kauai, I really loved Kauai. It's called the Garden Island.

Michael | 41:00

Yes, I've been there. Yeah, and.

Silas | 41:01

It's so good. All the jungle and like the localism. And yeah, I really liked it there. It did still have that touch of, you know, tourism for sure, but I found it a lot more enjoyable.

Like easier on the eyes, a little bit more friendly.

Michael | 41:20

Yeah, it's a gym. Yeah.

Yeah. You Surfing there?

Silas | 41:24

Yeah. I did a lesson and then I actually, I did really good on my lesson. And I thought the next day I'd take my, take an eight footer instead of a nine footer. And the swell had picked up as well. And I went back to the same beach and it was like, I didn't even recognize the beach because of how different it was. It had rained.

So all of the debris from the river had flowed into the water. So it changed the color of the water. And the waves were probably like four times bigger than when I was doing my lesson, you know?

So they look huge and I was like, okay, here we go. You know? And I was by myself and I just kind of sent it and I could barely balance on the eight foot. And I was like, what is this?

Like, it's only a foot of difference. Like how could it be that much less stable? Because on the nine foot, it's like a tank. It's like a rock. It's not going anywhere.

Yeah. And then I thought eight footer, surely eight footer, no problem. And I shocked myself. I was like, whoa.

Like, and I didn't catch a single wave that day because I was so uncomfortable and out of my depth, it felt like, and I tried to paddle for a wave, but I couldn't commit to it, you know? I was too scared. And that was at 14. And I think that's probably the hardest thing about Surfing is shutting the fear off. Hey, like you really have to like swallow it in that split moment, you know, when you go to catch a wave and you're looking down the line and then you see it, it's like that make or break moment.

Like you either gotta like take a breath and fucking go for it, or you just gotta, you know, pull out or eat shit or whatever it is. But it's so intense, that moment of just like letting it go and just going for it. It's unreal. And I'm familiar with the sensation from other aspects of my life, but not on that level of intensity. It's such a, yeah.

Michael | 43:27

Yeah, that's a big roadblock to people's development in Surfing is fear, whether they realize it or not. Yeah.

Yeah. It's good awareness though.

Yeah. You would have noticed it on steroids in Tahiti with the clear water and the shallow reef.

Silas | 43:44

Unbelievable to any, because I've only Surfing in like Canada, the water's not super clear. It's like dark blue, you know? And same with here in New Zealand, like you do get some clear days, especially on the East coast, but like on the West coast, usually it's pretty murky.

Yeah. And Tahiti, but Tahiti is like another level.

Like you're on the wave and you can't tell the middle of the wave from the bottom of the wave because it's so glassy see -through. And it's just like, yeah. Insane. And I think that trip was very substantial for me. It was very like a pivotal point for me because it was like, I can go and I can Surfing a wave like that. And I really did a lot better than I thought I would.

You know, like I took myself by surprise and I was just like, I just couldn't even believe it. It was like, yeah.

Yeah.

Michael | 44:45

So how did you overcome? How do you deal with fear?

Silas | 44:55

I think it's kind of similar to like instead of feeling like you're not where you're supposed to be or like you want to be somewhere, but you're not there yet. And instead of appreciating how far you've come to get where you are now, you're worried about the next thing. I kind of feel like it's similar to that.

Like every wave that I ever didn't take because I was scared, I regretted it. And it's like, it's such an in the moment thing, but to like be present enough to remind yourself that you can't listen to the fear is, I'd say is yeah, as difficult as staying in the present and not appreciating what you have and where you've come from opposed to where you want to be.

Michael | 45:51

Yeah. Yeah. It's essentially what it is being in the present moment.

Yeah. Because even if you were thinking half a second into the future while you're paddling into a wave, yeah, it's taking you away from.

Silas | 46:04

Every time like I go to do my pop -up and I'm already thinking about, you know, my first maneuver, I just lose it. It's, you gotta be just like, yeah, you've really gotta. And I think I've experienced moments in the kitchen where I'm on, like I'm in the zone, I'm in my flow state. It's happened like twice, you know, like it's, and I always try and like in those kinds of moments, like what was different? What did I have for breakfast that day?

You know, like what led to that? And it's an interesting dynamic in the kitchen as well, because you can enter the flow state as a team and not just in the kitchen, but, you know, in general.

So it's, yeah, it's a very interesting thing because it's attainable and there is a way to get there, but going through the trial and error of figuring out how to like always be there is super challenging and super frustrating because you know you can do it, but a lot of the time you just can't. Like that's what it feels like to me. It's It.

Michael | 47:10

Elusive. Yeah. Is. There's been some good books written on it though.

Like the Rise of Superman, great book. Actually, Stephen Kotler has written a couple of books. His most recent one is called Nah Country where he teaches himself and a bunch of older people, 50 plus I think, skiers to start park skiing.

Silas | 47:34

Just like normal skiers? Who's.

Michael | 47:37

Never skied a park and has never slid a rail or anything. Okay. And he teaches them how to do it. Cool. He taught himself how to do it. Everyone said, no, you're too old to learn how to park ski. What are you talking about? You break a hip. And he did that and he threw just, because you enter the flow state when you're being challenged enough to not be boring, but not so much that where you're gonna hurt yourself or you fail. It's that sweet spot. I think he says it's between three and 4%.

Yeah. Challenge, like it has to be a little bit harder than yesterday, but not so hard that you're just gonna fail or hurt yourself.

Silas | 48:17

And I feel like Surfing is all that, you know? Yeah. For.

Michael | 48:24

Sure, because even if you get the same waves every day, you can still surf deeper or you can always, yeah, it's like the wave is a Canva for whatever you wanna do on it, whether it's long board or short board or whatever. So yeah, that's a good awareness too, flow state stuff. There's plenty of reading to be done on that too. There's other things. He even started an institute, I forget what it's called, where they really studied flow states. And I think there's a list of 12 things that need to happen in order for you to increase the chances of entering flow state.

Silas | 49:02

Yeah, there's actually a girl in Raglan, I can't remember her name or the name of her company, but she does that. She does like flow state training, whatever that would entail.

Yeah, and immediately I just went to individualism, like she's doing one -on -ones with people. And I kind of said something that made it obvious that I'd made an assumption. And she was like no, like I do whole teams of people, like kitchens, she gave off a little list of environments that you would do that in. And it's quite interesting. Yeah.

Michael | 49:44

It's really fascinating, the flow state science. Yeah, I took a deep dive years ago and I learned a lot.

Yeah, I mean, that's key if you wanna... In Surfing, it usually sort of, it often just happens.

Silas | 49:58

Automatically. Yeah, naturally. But I think you definitely tell when it doesn't day. That day that I was out was probably the worst Surfing that I had in a really long time. And it was super big swell, a video that blew up. It was like, I was on the inside that wave that I caught. The ones out back were like twice the size and like super heavy. And there was so many like just balls in the air.

Like crazy, like good Surfing out there on their guns. I was on my little 5 '10 because my step up's out of commission. And I had like four hours sleep. I was like a little bit hungover, I think. And I just, my head was not there at all. It was a really tough day in the water for me.

And then it blew up for like no reason. And I was like, why?

Like why that day? You know?

Yeah, it's kind of funny. Yeah, ironic a little bit.

Michael | 50:58

Life is mysterious. Yeah. Especially Surfing.

So how long are you in Raglan for?

Silas | 51:07

I leave on the 7th of January, going down to the South Island. Yeah. I'm probably gonna spend most of my time in Dunedin and the Catlins.

Michael | 51:18

Yeah. Have you got a job down there? Not.

Silas | 51:20

Yet. Yeah, just winging it.

Yeah. I love it.

Yeah. And I don't even have like a financial cushion to wing it but I'm just gonna wing it anyways.

You know, like I Yeah.

Michael | 51:28

Just - You're young and single, who cares?

Silas | 51:31

But not even like that. I just, opposed to like trying to force things, I really like making decisions and seeing how my environment responds to me. Because like I said, when we were calling earlier, I just feel like sometimes you feel a lot of resistance when you make a decision or like, maybe some signs that it's not a good idea. And sometimes you make a decision and everything just kind of clicks into place, almost like a domino effect, like the shuffling of the cards, you know? And yeah, I'm just kind of following that.

Michael | 52:14

And - Awesome, I think you can do good, man. You can do fine. Hope so.

Silas | 52:17

Yeah. But if I don't, it's okay.

You know, I'm just here for it. Yeah. Good or the bad.

Yeah.

Michael | 52:23

Awesome. Tell us your Instagram handle.

Silas | 52:27

It is surfandipitous.

Michael | 52:30

Can you spell that?

Silas | 52:31

S -U -R -F -E -N -D -I -P -I -T -O -U -S. Yeah.

Michael | 52:40

I'll put a link to that in the show notes.

Silas | 52:42

Awesome. Yeah, I like it. It's like serendipity.

Yeah. It's a good thing. Surfing and surfing, I figured they go pretty good together. That's how I came up with the handle, yeah. Awesome.

Michael | 52:55

I love it. And I urge everyone to give you a follow and follow your journey. And I think there's a lot of my listeners will be interested to see what's possible. And, you know, I think we'll all be able to learn something by following.

Silas | 53:14

Nice. Yeah. I'm super excited. And thank you. Sweet. I appreciate.

Michael | 53:18

It. Sweet. Thanks for coming by. Yeah.

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